VFM 49: SK win #rekt

[Eragon1329]

Spoiler:

/vote grumpynotacat

Excuse me?! I take serious offense to that. You just called a goomba a 'notacat'. That's seriously Catist of you.

Don't. You're basically daring her to spam 50+ different kitten gifs in retaliation while hungrily demanding your head as tribute. Trust me, she WILL do it.

FUCK
I totally should have done that!

and hey, don't warn them! D:<

I only just realized that I can't meta read you for shit and this is our first ever game together...

Craaaaaaaaaaap. D:

imo

Ejji is really...

like bleeding towny when they are town
thats my experience in 2 of my games with them on MS

I do kind of like Crimson's entrance this game so far. I'm kind of paranoid over Ejj and Eragon already, I totally see myself struggling to read them all game... xD

inb4Eragoncomplainsaboutmyparanoia

Why do you think you'll struggle to read them?

Because Eragon is literally unreadable and I love Ejj to pieces.

(I love Eragon too but he's more devious as we've discussed)

*angry welsh cat noises*

By the way, everyone, what do we think about the tactic of trying to avoid lynching the SK? I'm a bit torn thinking over what exactly our approach this game should be.

Like, because of the whole situation with the switches and all of the WIFOM hell, it's probably really safe to assume that Night Plans this game on our end are going to be utterly useless. We ultimately have no control over any of the night actions that get sent and that end up working, as all of that utility ultimately gets negated by the scum. So really, like, I view this game as 11 cits versus a 3v1 scum faction. The only thing really going for us is that the SK will want the Mafia as dead as badly as we do and can screw with their abilities in a way that we can't. (Like really, I'm still pretty salty that we didn't end up getting more citizens or even a role that can flip switches too.)

So, because of this, we at least have an SK that can crosskill into Mafia, and screw with their switches for as long as the Mafia remain alive. Plus, as more Mafia die, we effectively get stronger over time, since this frees more of the PRs and basically undoes a vanillasizer on the PRs. But if we lynch the SK, Scum loses a KP, but then we almost basically guarantee Scum never cross killing into each other the moment SK dies, and that could be pretty devastating, especially if multiple PRs die before hitting ever hitting Mafia.

Is it also in the better interest of the SK if they try to help us get a few Cop checks to work? They can't outright murder the Town if Mafia remains at full power, so if they did everything in their power to help us find associations between mafia, it's in all of our benefit, right?

Basically I'm unsure how Town wins without us getting lucky on the Vig or without SK helping us kill at least one of the Mafia. Is anyone else familiar with this setup?

I agree with you here

the serial killer is an asset early game
its not a bad kill, and always better than lynching town
but I think lynching mafia is always the best

hi losers im town again fuck

no

Thank you Uzay very cool.

Also we have 3 bloody cit claims already why yall do this...

kappa?

It obviously stands for Over Makes Gravely Unwinnable Setups.

hahahahaha, townie

Wait
I just take The joke
I wish I didnt take .
If We think We cant win , We cant win .
Dont lose your hope , Ever .
( If You Dont know The Story , look at endgame ( Last 2 days ) . )

lol
it has a 33% town winrate on MS
a site that has objectively better town players than here

I do kind of like Crimson's entrance this game so far. I'm kind of paranoid over Ejj and Eragon already, I totally see myself struggling to read them all game... xD

inb4Eragoncomplainsaboutmyparanoia

Why do you think you'll struggle to read them?

Because Eragon is literally unreadable and I love Ejj to pieces.

(I love Eragon too but he's more devious as we've discussed)

Pretty sure it is possible to read Eragon as Maf/not Maf .
Funny fact is recently whenever I use that read and read them as town without mentioning Neutral possibility , they somehow Turn Neutral .
Actually I am afraiding The fact that his Mafia Meta may change over time ( Last time We played with him being Maf was An old NFM )
But I think that I can Actually read him as Maf/not Maf .
And If I read him as second , I Will probably need some help between t/n read .

I mean
it helps that like
the last 6 games ive played or something
ive been neutral or town

lol

[Eragon1329]

wait what the shit
serial killer can switch a no-switch from mafia
what the hell
what is this balance
but it is true that serial killer should be maf-hunting if we mislynch

[Eragon1329]

Spoiler:

I flipped Citizen! ^_^
Good luck everyone!

I cc cit

/Vote Zucker

stop pretending like either cit claim is actually indicative

So You are completely Okay with This with knowing it help scum ?
/vote Flake
I Dont think You thought from town PoV there .

he literally said neither are AI

stopping people from BRINGING THEM UP IF THEY ARE AI
LIKE OTHER PEOPLE I COULD MENTION
making a big deal out of it

instead of just acting like its fake

Uzay is acting really townie rn btw

Not really.

it's mostly tone



........aaaand a stupid tell that I doesn't even need to work
but I still like the way he played till now

@Flake , didnt You find that enough ?
/unvote
/vote unvote
I Like your reaction to me
Even though I am not aggreeing with You and it is bad , and could be dangerous .

but the more we make it seem fake
the more scum thinks its fake
and will not be sure what to do

By the way, everyone, what do we think about the tactic of trying to avoid lynching the SK? I'm a bit torn thinking over what exactly our approach this game should be.

Like, because of the whole situation with the switches and all of the WIFOM hell, it's probably really safe to assume that Night Plans this game on our end are going to be utterly useless. We ultimately have no control over any of the night actions that get sent and that end up working, as all of that utility ultimately gets negated by the scum. So really, like, I view this game as 11 cits versus a 3v1 scum faction. The only thing really going for us is that the SK will want the Mafia as dead as badly as we do and can screw with their abilities in a way that we can't. (Like really, I'm still pretty salty that we didn't end up getting more citizens or even a role that can flip switches too.)

So, because of this, we at least have an SK that can crosskill into Mafia, and screw with their switches for as long as the Mafia remain alive. Plus, as more Mafia die, we effectively get stronger over time, since this frees more of the PRs and basically undoes a vanillasizer on the PRs. But if we lynch the SK, Scum loses a KP, but then we almost basically guarantee Scum never cross killing into each other the moment SK dies, and that could be pretty devastating, especially if multiple PRs die before hitting ever hitting Mafia.

Is it also in the better interest of the SK if they try to help us get a few Cop checks to work? They can't outright murder the Town if Mafia remains at full power, so if they did everything in their power to help us find associations between mafia, it's in all of our benefit, right?

Basically I'm unsure how Town wins without us getting lucky on the Vig or without SK helping us kill at least one of the Mafia. Is anyone else familiar with this setup?

We Obviously need Every scum lynch , but I Will prefer SK Dead over mafia .Why ? Let's compare with A Day 1 SK lynch with Day 1 Maf lynch
1) Tomorrow 10v3 versus 9v2v1
2) With SK lynch , Mafia has to free one of PRs . With All Mafia's have 3-shot , We Will be abi to use some PRs before it votes to end at worse situation ( assumation : We couldnt be able to lynch Maf for A while , Maf couldnt be able to kill our PRs )
With Maf lynch , SK can lock The PR We lynched from Mafia for A long time , and with 2 KPN , time wents stronger, and working faster against us.

Another thing I discovered is We can start using our Roles effectively when We Kill 2 scum . And Killing SK early is Actually Giving us More chance to kill A Mafia due less Dead town per Day , I think. Even it removes The possibility SK Killing Mafia .

Now time for me to give reasoning your town .

You start the discussion right away trying to lead Town.
You state your opinion like this to show Town what we should do in a very proper manor.
Your trying to help others Understand the Situation.
Scum wouldn’t be sole focused on SK because they need him to kill at least for the first night!

^_^

and scum can't control discussion or act like they are doing pro-town things?
he...
isn't fully focusing on SK?
and mafia don't need sk to kill
becuase its fairly balanced without a second KPN
I think its like 10v3 after an SK Lynch and kill
which is a little more town than normal
but also its basically vanilla for 3 nights
which makes it basically mountainous

[UzayAltay]

does jord ever fake a townslip like that

i doubt it

scum never overlooks info on switches since they all actively partake in using them so

jord is like always town probably

I want to open A paranthesis , he only slipped not Maf .
Even though I am leaning on town , he can be SK .

[Eragon1329]

Now I don’t know who Dash plays.
But I just feel as if he’s trying to fit in but is effort lacks majorly.
It feels really bad and I don’t think their really helping town whatsoever.

I don't know, I think flake is worse in that manner.

At least Flake is giving detail to back up what he’s done. ^_^
Dash Refuses to give Detail
Dash states stuff with no actual context
Dash doesn’t even look like they want to actually help town
Dash should be lynched today, if Flake is still very scummy tomorrow then we can definitely vote them.

since when has effort been strictly AI

I don't like how Zucker's "catchup" are only responses to me and they're all shadethrowing posts

/vote Zucker

dash is way too non-ragey and emotional to be scum
dash town ez :^)

Rick ejj where are you guys I need my sanity back

[UzayAltay]

It doesn't help scum because seth and crimson both know that claiming cit immediately is bad, they're literally just creating WIFOM

I really don’t understand that reaction

And I don’t like the conversation between uzay and flake. Flake kept saying that “claims might be fake even if town” and uzay seemed to SR him for “being ok with them”, which would make sense only if uzay didn’t understand flake’s point at all.
And I don’t think that can be the case
The SR feels possibly fake.

/vote tfios

Um well, Dash.
That vote seemed like it happened for the sole purpose of bluntly voting someone.
Tfios always claims Citizen Day 1 and they usually are Citizen ^_^.

When I was reading you seemed the most sketchy. *_^

Shitty read: Would Zucker have added the thing about tfio usually being cit if he knew that this time she isn’t? (SvS)
UNLESS THERE WAS A CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT BEFORE, I think it might be unlikely.
Zucker doesn’t seem like the type to intentionally write that to manipulate the townies into TRing his teammate…

I am remembering explaining This
Basicly I didnt Get Why it isnt antitown until I understand it may not be fully antitown
Still thinking it is on The antitownier Side due even it creates WIFOM , scum Dont have that WIFOM before So tecnically it still Gave scum something , and it is Okay Flake not thinking that deep
If he thought that , but still make that comment , I am Okay with revote
The thing is I cant know If he thought that or not
( He even ignored my question about You , /poke Flake here .)

[Eragon1329]

So some things to note is how Goomba didn't do much until Flake started accusing me, and Zucker supposedly skipped until my response to Flake and only my posts as a catchup. Flake himself I'll be going into once I am on my laptop, but I have reason to believe at least one of these are scum.

<3 nice claim

one of (goomba, zucker, flake) is mafia

1 of 3 people

in a 15 player game
with 4 scum

thats pretty much
the exact chances by rand

fun :^)

/s

reasoning being because entry was wolfy

tfios entries are always similarly wolfy

nai

That's not gonna change my view

read openings of tfios in almost any game and you will see similar irrespective of alignment

Uzay is town honestly

Why do you think so? Just curious.

Because he's being how he always is as town, plus nothing strikes me as scummy.

can you be a bit more specific

No

/vote Dash2

Lol now that's a bad vote. Dash's intentions to make posts like that feel like they have town motivation. And their vote also.

"dash's intentions to do this feel like town intention"

what even?

[UzayAltay]

Spoiler:

I flipped Citizen! ^_^
Good luck everyone!

I cc cit

/Vote Zucker

stop pretending like either cit claim is actually indicative

So You are completely Okay with This with knowing it help scum ?
/vote Flake
I Dont think You thought from town PoV there .

he literally said neither are AI

stopping people from BRINGING THEM UP IF THEY ARE AI
LIKE OTHER PEOPLE I COULD MENTION
making a big deal out of it

instead of just acting like its fake

Uzay is acting really townie rn btw

Not really.

it's mostly tone



........aaaand a stupid tell that I doesn't even need to work
but I still like the way he played till now

@Flake , didnt You find that enough ?
/unvote
/vote unvote
I Like your reaction to me
Even though I am not aggreeing with You and it is bad , and could be dangerous .

but the more we make it seem fake
the more scum thinks its fake
and will not be sure what to do

By the way, everyone, what do we think about the tactic of trying to avoid lynching the SK? I'm a bit torn thinking over what exactly our approach this game should be.

Like, because of the whole situation with the switches and all of the WIFOM hell, it's probably really safe to assume that Night Plans this game on our end are going to be utterly useless. We ultimately have no control over any of the night actions that get sent and that end up working, as all of that utility ultimately gets negated by the scum. So really, like, I view this game as 11 cits versus a 3v1 scum faction. The only thing really going for us is that the SK will want the Mafia as dead as badly as we do and can screw with their abilities in a way that we can't. (Like really, I'm still pretty salty that we didn't end up getting more citizens or even a role that can flip switches too.)

So, because of this, we at least have an SK that can crosskill into Mafia, and screw with their switches for as long as the Mafia remain alive. Plus, as more Mafia die, we effectively get stronger over time, since this frees more of the PRs and basically undoes a vanillasizer on the PRs. But if we lynch the SK, Scum loses a KP, but then we almost basically guarantee Scum never cross killing into each other the moment SK dies, and that could be pretty devastating, especially if multiple PRs die before hitting ever hitting Mafia.

Is it also in the better interest of the SK if they try to help us get a few Cop checks to work? They can't outright murder the Town if Mafia remains at full power, so if they did everything in their power to help us find associations between mafia, it's in all of our benefit, right?

Basically I'm unsure how Town wins without us getting lucky on the Vig or without SK helping us kill at least one of the Mafia. Is anyone else familiar with this setup?

We Obviously need Every scum lynch , but I Will prefer SK Dead over mafia .Why ? Let's compare with A Day 1 SK lynch with Day 1 Maf lynch
1) Tomorrow 10v3 versus 9v2v1
2) With SK lynch , Mafia has to free one of PRs . With All Mafia's have 3-shot , We Will be abi to use some PRs before it votes to end at worse situation ( assumation : We couldnt be able to lynch Maf for A while , Maf couldnt be able to kill our PRs )
With Maf lynch , SK can lock The PR We lynched from Mafia for A long time , and with 2 KPN , time wents stronger, and working faster against us.

Another thing I discovered is We can start using our Roles effectively when We Kill 2 scum . And Killing SK early is Actually Giving us More chance to kill A Mafia due less Dead town per Day , I think. Even it removes The possibility SK Killing Mafia .

Now time for me to give reasoning your town .

You start the discussion right away trying to lead Town.
You state your opinion like this to show Town what we should do in a very proper manor.
Your trying to help others Understand the Situation.
Scum wouldn’t be sole focused on SK because they need him to kill at least for the first night!

^_^

and scum can't control discussion or act like they are doing pro-town things?
he...
isn't fully focusing on SK?
and mafia don't need sk to kill
becuase its fairly balanced without a second KPN
I think its like 10v3 after an SK Lynch and kill
which is a little more town than normal
but also its basically vanilla for 3 nights
which makes it basically mountainous

Should I really explain Same thing third time with sleep walking over my head ?

[Eragon1329]

Spoiler:

btw @Rick

I think the current numbers depend on whether we lynch the SK or not

On D1 that’s always a yes, after more town are dead than scum probably no

sounds right to me

my o key is now broken along with my e key

fun

didnt you just type those :/

If anything, you're being a hypocrite. If I need to go and be specific about Uzay's meta then how about you show me all the games where tfios was town and had a bad entrance. You didn't do that, did you?

difference between being vague when not asked to explain something which should be obvious and remaining vague once asked to explain something unobvious to anyone but you because either you can't be bothered or you can't actually draw similarities between town!uzay and uzay here which can be observed by anyone, in which case i don't see how you even believe your metaread yourself

as for tfios thing

VFM48 (Town):

yo whats up

im gonna hard claim cit bc y not

17F (Town):

"Let me get in on that cit claim action"

now play spot why i'd think tfios' entrance in this game would be NAI at worst

Does Flake do things like this when hes scum? Idk tbh

Feels townie though

yes i do probably

Bon bon Flake passes test, saying a thing he did could come from scum!Flake!

Flake feels townie

how is that passing a test

scum will say they could do it as scum for other reasons too...

[UzayAltay]

Spoiler: Fist raised, you could cause a reaction
Ain't nobody gonna fuck with me (fuck with me)
I can tell by the way that you're acting
And we could both agree
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya'
I mix pain with a little satisfaction
They go together all the same to be
I'm just tryna stay ahead of the action
And we could both agree
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I smile but there's blood in my reflection
There's violence in the poetry (poetry)
When it's over, there's no resurrection
At least for you and me
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I march on, just like violence
Today, I'll break the silence
Feels good, be compliant
Do you see me when you close your eyelids
Today I'ma get back up
Fists raised, let's get close up
Your life won't be so rough
Get the fuck up, 'cause we've had enough
Here we lay
In our final hours, like dying flowers
The price we pay
As you struggle for power that your ego devours (ego devours)
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I march on, just like violence
Today, I'll break the silence
Feels good, be compliant
Do you see me when you close your eyelids

Eragon
There was some good times when You just post sth Like This as town .
But later You started to post This as every alignment
This lose their furction
So , what's The reason of keep posting these ?

maybe

just maybe

because I want to post it

because its fun

?

you literally did the same thing with a picture of a cat that I posted for like, no reason
and ur like "whats the meaning with this"
>literally a cat picture

Wait
Havent that cat meant fluffy ?
And This two aren't close , I am not good with knowing other meaning of words , for example at Another Game somebody posted A Tree
Which I learnt later means shade
But at there , I just asked an honest question
I knew there wasnt any meaning , which is critical difference
Also I remembered All gold times when I can read You accurately with just looking " Did he posted sth Like poem "
So , Yes , it wasnt noteworthy probably , I just wanted to ask an honest question.
Actually not even hoping for You answering . Thanks

[Eragon1329]

first friendly reminder of the game that spoiler tag exists so can we stop clogging the thread with long quote chains

and not the last

pets

Phone is town

I agree

Chemist has been very off.
He doesn’t really add anything new to the conversation.
Dash is only saying Phone is Town because scum wants someone to follow them! ^_^
Qva did it to Seththeking and it worked on him. ^_^

once again
when has effort been strictly AI

guys let me know when zucker isn't being useless I'm blocking him now

Isn’t it illegal to block someone participating?

HAH

HAH

NO

[Eragon1329]

Spoiler: Fist raised, you could cause a reaction
Ain't nobody gonna fuck with me (fuck with me)
I can tell by the way that you're acting
And we could both agree
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya'
I mix pain with a little satisfaction
They go together all the same to be
I'm just tryna stay ahead of the action
And we could both agree
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I smile but there's blood in my reflection
There's violence in the poetry (poetry)
When it's over, there's no resurrection
At least for you and me
I never felt so low
But I love the way I look, yeah
With this bloody nose
Look how many hits it took ya
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I march on, just like violence
Today, I'll break the silence
Feels good, be compliant
Do you see me when you close your eyelids
Today I'ma get back up
Fists raised, let's get close up
Your life won't be so rough
Get the fuck up, 'cause we've had enough
Here we lay
In our final hours, like dying flowers
The price we pay
As you struggle for power that your ego devours (ego devours)
Here I go down this broken road
My smile still shows through my bloody nose
Still, I go (ooh)
Still, I go (ooh)
Yeah, I go (ooh)
I march on, just like violence
Today, I'll break the silence
Feels good, be compliant
Do you see me when you close your eyelids

Eragon
There was some good times when You just post sth Like This as town .
But later You started to post This as every alignment
This lose their furction
So , what's The reason of keep posting these ?

maybe

just maybe

because I want to post it

because its fun

?

you literally did the same thing with a picture of a cat that I posted for like, no reason
and ur like "whats the meaning with this"
>literally a cat picture

Wait
Havent that cat meant fluffy ?
And This two aren't close , I am not good with knowing other meaning of words , for example at Another Game somebody posted A Tree
Which I learnt later means shade
But at there , I just asked an honest question
I knew there wasnt any meaning , which is critical difference
Also I remembered All gold times when I can read You accurately with just looking " Did he posted sth Like poem "
So , Yes , it wasnt noteworthy probably , I just wanted to ask an honest question.
Actually not even hoping for You answering . Thanks

well yea
but still

oh yeah
I also think I was the one that posted the tree
yea it was definitely me
it was about ElderSivart
im confident now lmfao
that was me

hehe

[Eragon1329]

fuck I didnt think the quote was that long

sorry dash-san

[Flake]

{Flake} Town
{Dash2} ++++
{} +++
{Phone0Ix} ++
{tfiosforevah, Qvapil, UzayAltay, Zucker, ejjinami} +
{Chemist1422, Eragon1329, ProtoZigg, Crimson97, cupcakeaj2, GrumpyGoomba} Null (Approximately 50% chance of scum flip)
{Rickdaily12} -
{} --
{} ---
{} ----
{} Scum

[Eragon1329]

{Flake} Town
{Dash2} ++++
{} +++
{Phone0Ix} ++
{tfiosforevah, Qvapil, UzayAltay, Zucker, ejjinami} +
{Chemist1422, Eragon1329, ProtoZigg, Crimson97, cupcakeaj2, GrumpyGoomba} Null (Approximately 50% chance of scum flip)
{Rickdaily12} -
{} --
{} ---
{} ----
{} Scum

why is rick scum???

[Flake]

{Flake} Town
{Dash2} ++++
{} +++
{Phone0Ix} ++
{tfiosforevah, Qvapil, UzayAltay, Zucker, ejjinami} +
{Chemist1422, Eragon1329, ProtoZigg, Crimson97, cupcakeaj2, GrumpyGoomba} Null (Approximately 50% chance of scum flip)
{Rickdaily12} -
{} --
{} ---
{} ----
{} Scum

why is rick scum???

I hate not being able to state my reasons but it really is more beneficial if I don't say, I don't want rick to be able to adapt to my reasoning

If the trend follows as the game progresses my read on him likely becomes stronger

[Flake]

oh also hi eragon you're actually here owo

[Flake]

also i actually put a good amount of effort into that list

so take of it what you will

[Chemist1422]

@Eragon
Effort has always been AI and if you try to say otherwise Watt will sub in and yell at you

Murphy's Law says Dash is SK but I'm not willing to go after this yet

[Flake]

I hate not being able to state my reasons but it really is more beneficial if I don't say, I don't want rick to be able to adapt to my reasoning

If the trend follows as the game progresses my read on him likely becomes stronger

i want him to post more before i explain my read on him to see whether it holds over a longer period of time, so i'm testing the accuracy of the read

if i explain it now he can adapt to my explanation for scum reading him

but i will explain before eod1

[Flake]

@Eragon
Effort has always been AI and if you try to say otherwise Watt will sub in and yell at you

Murphy's Law says Dash is SK but I'm not willing to go after this yet

jord is town

[cupcakeaj2]

Hello, I didn't didn't say I didn't think I will not not didn't say I didn't hardclaim not Doctor

[Flake]

@Eragon
Effort has always been AI and if you try to say otherwise Watt will sub in and yell at you

Murphy's Law says Dash is SK but I'm not willing to go after this yet

because watt knows all?

amount of effort isn't always AI, but it can be

[Flake]

chemist post more so i can resolve you

[cupcakeaj2]

Idea: Don't look at your rolecard until N1