VFM43 | No Hope (Plus One) | Game Over (Doomed To Suffer)

[TheWabbit]

town slip not accepted my friend

I'm asking because it's not in the OP. It usually is.

Why is this the topic that you feel is worthy of commenting about though?
There's been plenty of shit going on.
Who is your biggest SR right now?
I know it's early, but has anything pinged you?

We have six. I repeat. Six. Pages of content. No. Nothing has pinged me. There's hardly nothing to work with. I don't look for single posts, I look for patterns. And there can be no patterns with such a small amount of content to work with.

oh god this gets better and better

[TheWabbit]

Can't we just do that regardless of the status of Mafia chat?

Just assume there's at least some coordination between Mafia.

[hereisme]

Ugh. Okay. I'm off work and caught up. While I appreciate the extremely detailed analysis of my one contentful post, I think you're making a whole lot of something out of nothing. I have, admittedly been pretty absent; but I plan on changing that. So, hit me. What's y'all's theories on the possibility of a powerwolf? Also does mafia have a daychat?

town slip not accepted my friend

I'm asking because it's not in the OP. It usually is.

What will you do with that information then?

With that knowledge we would know rather or not scum is able to plan wagons during the day. if they are, we could be on the lookout for suspicious voting/wagoning.

I mean, that's something to be on the lookout for either way.
Always run on the assumption there's day chat.
Because even when there isn't, scum still know who buddies are.
You're not really providing anything useful.
And there is actually plenty of content to look over.
So I recommend you read it all and give some SRs.

[tfiosforevah]

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

if that were a reaction test you've failed it miserably

When I react with a long post freaking out, I fail and Get lynched and flip town.
When I react calmly, I apparently fail also
Apparently I don’t know how to react properly

[tfiosforevah]

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

Haha do you think I care?
I'll tell you that I do not. if you're not progressing the game and if I think you're scummy, I will get rid of you regardless how shitty my arguments are
Besides, I do think that you're scummy and saying that "you're always like that" is not a convincing argument

And tbh I know I asked for it, but I don't really care for a readlist from you
try to interact with the other players and push them a bit, it's really not that hard

And what makes you so towny? I’m not automatically scum reading you because you scum read me but i don’t exactly see a strong case in your favor either

[TheWabbit]

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

if that were a reaction test you've failed it miserably

When I react with a long post freaking out, I fail and Get lynched and flip town.
When I react calmly, I apparently fail also
Apparently I don’t know how to react properly

It's the ultimate puzzle.

The main reason why your reaction is irksome is because of the reference to self-meta.

[ejjinami]

Ok, so I've been trying to make sense of uzay's posts and I thought that I should write it down so that I don't have to go through it again if I want to read him later.
The grammar and spelling have been mostly corrected and tbh I finally feel that I understand what he said, lol. Or like, I understand what I think he said :(
You never know
Anyways, @Uzay, can you check if I understood the posts correctly? I know you asked some questions and there are things I want to comment on as well, but I'm sleepy so it can wait and I'd prob want you to confirm it anyways.

uzay's translated iso, post nr. 3
Spoiler:

First off: I want to leave most of my posts for the last IRL day, during which I'll be posting frequently

Any doc plans without a revealed doc will only make cross-healing more likely to happen

What if the 2 docs are in the same group? How do you know if they aren't?
No one knows, so just stop it

And the cop is revealed rn, so I really suggest not taking the risk

If the Docs are in the same group they could be unlucky to indeed heal the same person but it's still better because they don't heal each other

That's not the only problem with that. This will cause the players in the other group to be completely without protection.

#3089451: What exactly did you hate?
#3089486 : TBH I am inclined to believe this because it makes no sense to do that from a scum PoV (assuming the docs are smart enough not to claim immediately)
#3089564:
1) :TooBadSoSad: :Sangry:
2) No problem for me.
3) No comment.
4) ++
5)6) I believe RvS posts are more important than "jokes". They shouldn't be always considered "bad" as James says, but they shouldn't be completely ignored either

#3089569 : Have you explained the vote yet?

#3089608 :
1)++
2)Ok.
3) I'm not sure, but it doesn't make much sense considering the D1 cop claim.
4) I think "shade " is the exact definition, he wrote both good and bad things in the same post without saying which side he is leaning on.
I will look into it if he has clarified his opinion and if he hasn't, he should.
Next: I agree on Phone?'s plan being bad. I believe Ejji said she missed the mechanics when asking the docs to claim and considering the scenario she had in mind, the plan makes sense to me, because it guarantees the cop staying alive for 2+ nights.
#3089618 : Can You explain the read on ejj?
Also is the "slightest lean" bracket based on gut? ( I didn't see you commenting much about them )

#3089623#3089624: Why did you read it that way? ( Don't answer if you've already done it )

#3089628 : Is it his Meta? (trying to stop RvS)
I don't think the vote was "slightly OMGUS", considering that james's ideas were directly opposing ejji's ideas. The vote comes from from a clash of ideas, not from him thinking "Oh My God You voted me, You suck so You should be lynched"
#3089655 : Scorpio giving lock-V read would be a problem, but him not saying which interpretation he thinks is correct is a bigger problem. This is also what pinged hereisme and I don't think they're wrong here.


(Lets waste a post. I still have a lot left for tomorrow anyway. I was thinking of writing all of it in 1 post, but whatever.)

uzay's translated iso, post nr. 4
Spoiler:

[---snipped my (ejji's) wall---]

2) Yes, I was thinking like that as well. Actually, there isn't even a need for us to do that as we can benefit from it later (associations)

#3089697 : About James, I think The problem isn't James being against RvS but him scumreading RvS'ers so harshly (I hope I used the correct word) (~ejj note: I think "strongly" would have been better. If I understood the post correctly, that is~)
If doing that is James's Meta, it makes sense from his PoV. Phone's push doesn't make much sense to me, but also doesn't seem to be coming from scum, so I'm leaning TvT on them rn.
If this isn't james's meta, then I'm curious why would he SR the "RvS voters"

Ejji part : TBH the first thing you mentioned would be likely to come from bad scum, so yes, it is possible. I am agreeing with Ejj here that it is more likely to come from town though. THE MAIN PROBLEM WITH IT IS THAT HE DIDN'T ACTUALLY GIVE A RUSHED TR. If he gave one, it would be discussable, but I would lean townie. But he didn't give a townlean, he just implied it, which pings me. In a hypothetical future where Chemist flips scum, he could easily say "I didn't TR him."

2) The problem is that throwing shade at an experienced player doesn't make much sense UNLESS the mafia is planning to push that player and by throwing shade scorpio is making way for that. (which doesn't make much sense if trying to push Chemist, but could be possibly used on ERAGON, who isn't as townie as Chem (and you are saying the one scorpio was going to TR at first was Eragon))
Or it could be a "failed, fake interaction", which I don't know if it could come from a Era&Scorp SvS or Chem&Scorp SvS, but I think the 2'nd is very unlikely given that Chemist is townie and there is basically no need for the mafia to do that.
And I don't think if Scorpio was actually guided it would be that bad ( speaking about First ) , so SvS Era/Scorp is also unlikely . (~ejj note: last sentence is unedited, cuz I don't understand it at all.~)
Or, we're basically overthinking everything here.

TLDR : IMO it is between S-Scorp V-Era , or V-Scorp / ?-Era

#3089764:lolflag: :lolflag:
#3089778 I also want to take this lesson TBH :)
#3089794 Why can't he be town ? It is completely possible I think .
#3089796 1) How it is a townread ? :Thonk:
2)Was that sarcasm ?
5) What ?

#3089847 : :Facepalm:
#3089852 : 2)I can say it Will definitely worth it , but the problem is what could the mafia's next plan be in case the cop doesn't CC (I'm assuming exa is scum here), so I'm not sure. I'm leaning on them being town, but I'll be confident in it only if I can tell that "This can't be a scum strategy"

uzay's translated iso, post nr. 5
Spoiler:

---snip---

I actually looked at Scorp's posts again and my theories about him seriously had some issues, but there are still some issues with Scorpio's posts as well.

About the first post:
Scorpio didn't actually have any content except 2 posts, which we talked about a lot before. And TBH those posts weren't very townie either.
I think it's important to know "when" he made those posts. I didn't check, but if it was after people started TRing Chem, the posts don't make Scorpio townie.
If the posts were written earlier, then it isn't bad. I completely overlooked the time factor when writing about it previously.

About the 2'nd post:
TBH hereisme's comments made me think Eragon could have been the one Scorpio was talking to in that post, but I think I solved what actually happened there.
Now, let's look at the: "What and How Did It Happen " part of it.

What and How Did It Happen :

Before starting, I wanted to say that I might sometimes slip my opinion among the "facts" I'm presenting, so sorry for that.

Okay, first off let's look at the posts in chronological order and try to understand how are they connected and what do they mean.

A)#3089207 : TBH I started to see where Ejji's opinion came from when I noticed that it was scorpio's first post, but let's look at it a bit closer:

"Okay well Chemist is being very productive This Game . Either town or some next level powerwolfing."
Legend:
u= amplifier
s = Honesty
b= contradiction (opposites)
Green = + opinion
Red = - opinion
[color=#FFFF00Yellow [/color]= Null / Nullish opinion

The things we should think about imo:
Had this not been his first post, would your opinion on it have been different?
Given that scorpio actually connected one Null (or maybe a slightly town-creddy) "behavior" to one townie and one scummy "interpretation", but used an "amplifier" on Null and an "extra effort" on scum in order to imply that the townie interpretation is more probable,
what was Scorpio aiming for when writing that post ? (from a V and W perspective)
If he knew that there were other players who could also be TR based on their "productivity", why did he write solely about chemist?
But the most important question is, what's that thing he TR in Chemist's posts, but didn't TR in the other players' ? For what reason? Scorpio said that chem was "Town or powerwolfing scum" but he didn't imply that he was SRing him
Does that mean Scorpio is saying chemist is "town" or "townie scum", or "town" but for a weird, unsaid reason, which I don't understand?
Etc. It's prob possible to add more questions to the list


Now , Lets look at other post :

Eragon towny for setting up good mechanical play

Scorpio is a FeelsWeird for mentioning me and not Eragon

TBH I forgot about you. Sorry. But yeah. Same goes for you

I made the last part green, becuase I'm assuming it's a TR.
Now, about the possibilities:

Scorpio's motivations from a V / W pov

1) He actually forgot who he town-read, misread Chem's post and town-read Chem agaim because of ???? / to avoid pressure.
2) He thought Eragon made the post instead of Chem, misread Chem's next post and TR Chem for ???? / to avoid pressure .
3) He hasn't actually mixed anything up , ???? / ????
4) ... I cant find any other possible explanations atm, so I'm suspecting him a bit, especially because I can't explain the "You Also Get the Same read " part. What is your opinion about that?

I actually wanted to write more about that and about the others but I have to go to sleep.

[ejjinami]

Ugh. Okay. I'm off work and caught up. While I appreciate the extremely detailed analysis of my one contentful post, I think you're making a whole lot of something out of nothing. I have, admittedly been pretty absent; but I plan on changing that. So, hit me. What's y'all's theories on the possibility of a powerwolf? Also does mafia have a daychat?

wordy, reminds me of my strategy back then

/vote ScorpioDiAngelo

Elaborate
And what do you think of scorpio's early posts?

[ejjinami]

Can't we just do that regardless of the status of Mafia chat?

Just assume there's at least some coordination between Mafia.

How does this matter?

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

if that were a reaction test you've failed it miserably

When I react with a long post freaking out, I fail and Get lynched and flip town.
When I react calmly, I apparently fail also
Apparently I don’t know how to react properly :lol:

It's ok, you don't actually have to worry about it, just try.
What you're talking about rn is posting in self-defense and that's just one of the minor reasons for SRing people imo.
If you're town, finding and pressuring scum should be your main goal, so tbh even if you ignore everything else and focus on that solely, even if it kills you, it'll still be better than if you stay passive

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

Haha do you think I care?
I'll tell you that I do not. if you're not progressing the game and if I think you're scummy, I will get rid of you regardless how shitty my arguments are
Besides, I do think that you're scummy and saying that "you're always like that" is not a convincing argument

And tbh I know I asked for it, but I don't really care for a readlist from you
try to interact with the other players and push them a bit, it's really not that hard

And what makes you so towny? :roll: I’m not automatically scum reading you because you scum read me but i don’t exactly see a strong case in your favor either

why aren't you SRing me? If I understood it correctly, you didn't like my previous posts

And tbh I don't think I need a strong reason to push anyone. Same goes for lynching, assuming that I really don't have any strong leans
Do you think it's scummy?

[Eragon1329]

Also notes on claiming:

Due to the doctors being macho and the cop being our only TI.

Do not claim until you are specifically asked to claim. There is always a chance that you won’t be the lynch, and a claimed citizen is basically useless, will never die at night, and could possibly be mislynched later.

So always leave that air of mystery on whether you are a PR or not, and frankly i’d Prefer never claiming until the lynch is 100% set, and only CFD’ing off of the lynch if the target is a PR

I hardclaim sheriff.

We don’t even need to hypo, whichever doc has me in their pool heals me.

wtf

anyways the doc pool was a bad idea so we aren't doing that anyways

[Eragon1329]

Claiming goon. My buddies are lilgangsta and Eragon1329

Why didn't you mention me?
makes me sad

Hey gamers I’m at a school dance

xd
Ok, i want to joke after all
I'm really tempted to throw one here, even though I know I shouldn't
Stupid game rules...

wanna dance Ejji

Solution for doc1/2 problem. It's not perfect but still something to start with. Only problem with it is me, because I'm number 7.

If the Doc is within number 1-6, they heal someone from 8-13.
If the Doc is within number 8-13, they heal someone from 1-6.

Now docs got more chance of spread healing, and if they are in the same pool they never heal each other. And if we add me, number 7 to it, we got one bigger pool, but I guess we could add me to the 1-6.

Opinions on this? Also I think hypoing is a good plan. And Eragon is likely town I think. No opinions on others yet. Chem's action could come from both town and scum I think.

thats literally the same thing except different. also why am i towny and not chem?

[Eragon1329]

holy mother waller

[Eragon1329]

First off, I don't think chemist's intro is that town-indicative. It was perfectly constructed and chem even wrote about the game it was inspired on, so there's a really big chance that it was written before the game started. I think the idea is good in general, but it's not anything immediately game solving and can be used by both alignments, so I don't really understand the people who TR it heavily. I mean, it's good, but not really AI imo.

Okay well Chemist is being very productive in this game. Either town or some next level powerwolfing.

Prob not SvS
The post is a big exaggeration, but it feels like a relatively honest attempt to scumhunt, so I think I like it
Besides, scum tend to be more hesitant in giving strong TRs, so I guess the post is good

I agree it probably isn't SvS, but I'm not sure it's TvT either.
Scorpio's post felt like shade on Chemist IMO, then Scorpio forgot who they'd even talked about.
Thought they mentioned Eragon rather than Chem.
Scorpio never really said they TR either person.
Now we haven't heard from Scorpio since, so I'd like to see their new opinions.

I think Scorpio's post was townie. It looked like a reaction to chemist's 1st posts (the ones about hypo-claiming) and had to be based on these posts only because if I remember correctly, those were chem's only posts back then.

I don't really get what you mean by it being shade, I understood it as a spontaneous tonal TR because of the difference in the amount of reasoning in these posts and in chem's posts in general
(The first one was by far the most impressive post I remember ever coming from chemist as well tbh, even though I think it's NAI)

I think scorpio's TR is absolutely dumb and rushed, but it really doesn't feel scum-motivated to me.

First off, as I said before, I think it hints to them not being scummates because of how quick and strong the read was. I would be surprised if scorpio was the type to be able to just locktown one of his buddies based on their first post in the meme-phase
And the: "Either town or some next level powerwolfing" REALLY doesn't feel like SvS to me
Way too ballsy and way too stupid imo.

And then, would scum!scorpio be that enthusiastic to give a townie a locktown read so quickly?
From my experience, dumb, rushed actions tend to be one of the most AI/honest ones and this post really made me feel that he was completely ok with giving chem an early, confident TR, which should come from town more often than scum.

Eragon towny for setting up good mechanical play

Scorpio is a FeelsWeird for mentioning me and not Eragon

TBH I forgot about you. Sorry. But yeah. Same goes for you

I don't think think that was scummy btw. Scorpio's first read on chemist felt like a spontaneous/enthusiastic one, so I don't think him not noticing eragon is all that weird. Besides, I wouldn't expect much sense from scorpio's posts in general tbh
No offence

wait it was inspired based off of a different game?

also, have you ever noticed when people say "No offence" they normally say something very offensive

[ejjinami]

Hey gamers I’m at a school dance

xd
Ok, i want to joke after all
I'm really tempted to throw one here, even though I know I shouldn't
Stupid game rules...

wanna dance Ejji :FingerGuns: :FingerGuns:

squeak xD

[Eragon1329]

Btw eragon, I think I saw you lurking a few times
Turn off your activity or come and post

r00d

[ejjinami]

wait it was inspired based off of a different game?

also, have you ever noticed when people say "No offence" they normally say something very offensive

Wait, I'm not actually playing in any other game rn
Heh, you have no proof

No shit

[Eragon1329]

Uzay reads as towny

Ejji also townread(Not only the translation)

Hey gamers I’m at a school dance

xd
Ok, i want to joke after all
I'm really tempted to throw one here, even though I know I shouldn't
Stupid game rules...

wanna dance Ejji

squeak xD

hiss

p-edit: what?

[tfiosforevah]

Can't we just do that regardless of the status of Mafia chat?

Just assume there's at least some coordination between Mafia.

How does this matter?

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

if that were a reaction test you've failed it miserably

When I react with a long post freaking out, I fail and Get lynched and flip town.
When I react calmly, I apparently fail also
Apparently I don’t know how to react properly

It's ok, you don't actually have to worry about it, just try.
What you're talking about rn is posting in self-defense and that's just one of the minor reasons for SRing people imo.
If you're town, finding and pressuring scum should be your main goal, so tbh even if you ignore everything else and focus on that solely, even if it kills you, it'll still be better than if you stay passive

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

Haha do you think I care?
I'll tell you that I do not. if you're not progressing the game and if I think you're scummy, I will get rid of you regardless how shitty my arguments are
Besides, I do think that you're scummy and saying that "you're always like that" is not a convincing argument

And tbh I know I asked for it, but I don't really care for a readlist from you
try to interact with the other players and push them a bit, it's really not that hard

And what makes you so towny? I’m not automatically scum reading you because you scum read me but i don’t exactly see a strong case in your favor either

why aren't you SRing me? If I understood it correctly, you didn't like my previous posts

And tbh I don't think I need a strong reason to push anyone. Same goes for lynching, assuming that I really don't have any strong leans
Do you think it's scummy?

I never mentioned your posts so you must’ve misunderstood. And I never said it was scummy to not have a strong reason to push/lynch someone either. All I’m saying is that I don’t see a strong case of why you’re town, but I don’t have a strong scum read on you either. You’re a very null read in my point of view because I honestly can’t read you at the moment

[James]

/vote tfios

reee

Why not phone anymore? What is your read on them now?
And what do you think about scorpio/wabbit/james?

Phone still scum but the wagon isn’t going anywhere
Scorpio null
James towny if his main is who I think it is
Wabbit town-ish for reasons that I can’t word correctly

Stop it chemist
Also did you meant that wabbit actually calls people out for their shit?

[James]

god uzay is so hard to read

[James]

@lilgangsta what do you think about wabbit?
And wanna vote tfio with me?

Your attempt to create a wagon with no proof makes me laugh. Been busy this weekend, reads coming later tonight

Besides if you’ve played with me before you would know this is how I normally play d1

Scum101

[James]

I think scorpio wants to contribute but he doesn't know how to
That being said his responses are just oks and cools
Also had a few excuses
Plus him talking about the patterns really tipped me off
Like he isn't familiar with actual content at all
But I'm not confident that's he scum because some of these are very townish things

[James]

ejji is like a bitchy hyena
Plus we have bigger fishes to fry
Not like the wagon is even getting any attraction
/vote tfios

[James]

God, everyone is so bland nowadays.
I think phone should be our d2 wagon
Eragon is just saying random shite, I don't think he's even playing
and hereisme is too paranoid

[NotExacerbated]

I have posted 0 content.
But I have not been prodded.


This is nice.