The Accomplice, NE (1900+ VIEWS!)

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

Yay or Nay? (Specify reason if can ty :D)

Yay!
1
13%
Or
5
63%
Nay!
2
25%
 
Total votes : 8

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Postby Joacgroso » Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:25 am

Spoiler:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:Why is this role neutral evil if it can win with town?
Still working in the win conditions and goal. I don't really have to since I'm thinking it should just be NE.
Also, witnessing 4 kills is impossible.
Not so. Refer to the attributes.
How many times have you seen people predicting 4 kills in a game?
Well, as mostly a Doc main, it's a 80% chance for late game, 50% for mid game and 40% for early game to be able to predict who to kill.. Mostly, it depends on the player. This role shows them that they have to guess right or they delay their goal by one more night.


So...... What are you suggesting to change the goal to instead?

Or maybe change it's alignement to neutral benign.
See here, the Witness is hugely evil-sided since it can know who the killer is and the killer will just help the witness get more witnesses just so they wont be revealed.
But maybe I can balance the attributes a bit more
. He can also tell the town who the killers are so they don't kill him and he can witness vigilante/jailor kills, while evils would have to waste a night in order to get rid of him. Well, Town would just kill the Witness also since they can still have a chance to side with evils seeing the fact as they can give a buff. How many times have you seen Witch siding with Town then just getting hanged right after? Not to mention the evils wouldn't like that the Witness is siding with Town so they'd want to kill the Witness. Making you lose instantly. Lynching the witness would be pointless because he wouldn't be able to side with evils once he reveals. Everyone who whispered to him would be sus af. And there is a huge difference between witches and witnesses: Witches can't win with town. Witnesses can. Also, mafia don't have to kill witnesses because they are not town, so they wouldn't waste a kill on a neutral.
The main problem is that this role wouldn't affect the game at all.
Hmm.... I wonder why it's able to know who the killer is and is undetected by the Lookout, avoid Veteran aletts and WW mauls... (This is totally not here). Ok. That doesn't affect the game at all. What's the point of knowing who the killer is if you want to side with him? The only thing he would do is whisper to the killer to witness more kills, so if one of them dies then the other will be lynched. And if he tries to whisper to a NK and there is a bmer ingame, then the NK auto loses. And having astral visits doesn't make witnesses affect the game at all, unless they decide to reveal the killers and side with town.
Well, that's why the Witness dosn't get any defense. That's in-order to do so that the Witness should be able to find the killer more quicker.Sorry, I don't understand. What has being able to be killed and lose n1 to do with finding killers quickier? Not to mention there might be a Doc or BG protecting you. That depends of your fakeclaim. They would usually protect the jailor or any person who claimed a TPower role. Also, being protected n1 is a matter of luck. The Witness has no defense because their point is to give defense and if they think the killer will kill them, they would just side with Town, Vig and Jailor can still help on your goal. You just said they were evil sided and town would lynch them if they claim. And siding with town won't prevent them for dying either. And the point of whispering to someone is very risky.How are they supposed to guess 4 kills without whispering with the killer? The only thing that can make a Witness side with the killer is if they spam-vote the killer or if they whisper a very "strange" whisper seeing if there is a bmer in game. And getting the fact that every day, the killer would say who he would kill next just so that they would get a buff. That would make the Witness even more sus aswell as who they were whispering with. That's why I said they don't affect the game at all. They know who the killer is, but can't do anything about him except outing him in his last will if they die. WHAT CAN YOU SUGGEST THEN? --ahem-- Other than that, is there any way you can suggest to change it? You are the one suggesting the role, not me. You asked for feedback, so I told you what I think might be flaws. Maybe I'm wrong and these are not flaws, or maybe I'm right. But it's not my job to fix them if I have no better ideas. Honestly, the only things I can think are changing it's goal to "survive to see the town lose the game", giving them an autovest only for night 1, and making them only buff evils roles if they succesfully witness a kill. I'm not sure about astral visits, but I have no better ideas. Also, on a side note,
I think you should change the name of the role. "Witness" isn't evil enough in my opinion. I have no better ideas through. And something more: I think witnesses shouldn't have astral visits, since they are already detection immune. If they are caught by a smart lookout, it's their fault anyway.


It would be like a survivor.
Well, it can't defend itself seeing as the fact it can know who the killer is. Being granted 3 vests and being able to know who the killer is....... No.
And, Survivor can't know who is the killer unless they reveal themselves
. Since witness's goal is to witness 4 kills, that means that he auto losses if he dies in nights 1, 2, or 3. And with survivor I meant kingmaker who doesn't affect the game at all. Witnesses should have a scum autovest, just like witches. Maybe they should be able to watch themselves once if they still have the autovest.
The Witness can die in nights 1, 2 or 3. But by then, they would have already found the killer and the chances being killed in a 15-player game is in night 1,2 or 3, especially with a Townie confirming others would make you an unlikely target. But I do agree with the scum autovest tho. Ill consider that. Kills in night 1, and sometimes 2, are a matter of luck.
And how many times have you seen people correctly guessing a kill in the first 3 nights? This don't usually happens, especially if mafia isn't stupid and goes for obvious targets.
That goes on the luck of the player, then. Roles that are based on luck are bad ideas, especially if they are not NC. Since this role would be able to spawn in ranked, it shouldn't be luck-based (yes, I know that jesters can also die n1 and lose, but I think they shouldn't spawn in ranked anyway, and they should have basic defense for night 1 only. Amnesiacs too).

His ability is to passive to mess with town,
Any role that is a killing role specifically.
but it wouldn't work as NB because it would be too hard. Guessing 4 kills is impossible, especially if you have no defense at night.
Well, you can technically get 2 witnesses in 1 night by visiting a Lookout protected by a Bodyguard and attacked by a Mafioso. Unlikely af. Very likely in late game. Only if mafia is dumb enough to go for an obviously protected person. At that point the bg should have claimed if he was rt. And if he wasn't, attacking an obvious target would be suicidal. Also, surviving until lategame as evil, isn't that easy. Well, with the buff for the killing roles, it would be easy since the evil-killing roles can teak up and use theWitness as a buff. But, nonetheless, what can you suggest? Other than this useless argument. Also, if evils get the astral buff, then they will be bodyguard-immune, so witnessing this would be really hard in late game. And just because I don't have better ideas it doesn't mean that my argument is invalid.

That results to 2 deaths and since you were watching Lookout, you get 2 witnesses. Also goes for Vet and WW. You said that if he visits someone who dies to vet, it will count as a witness, so if they visit the vet they won't witness anything. If the Vet was vet-baiting, they would be able to witness something.Not to mention you can know who the Jailor is if they execute the target you were watching. I thought all visits failed on jailed targets.
But if he finds the jailor, he can just tell him who to execute and get other 2 witnesses.
The visits will fail on a JAILED target. But if it's an EXECUTE, it's successful. I didn't know that. So if a janitor cleans an executed person, he will be cleaned? I'm trying to implement a role that can affect a jailed person. Mafia and Evils aren't the same from their abilities. I'm also going for that because, lore-wise, the Witness can see the one who is jailed if they try to visit that person and, common sense, the Witness can see the jailed to be executed. And telling the Jailor who to execute can make the NK kill you instead Not if you whisper to the jailor or even the Jailor will execute you since your still Evil If they prefer wasting a kill on a Ne instead of killing a killer, then it's their problem.. Please read the attributes again. I can only see "Each night choose a player to gossip with". Read again. I did it. The only thing I don't like is that this role hardcounters lookouts. If TP are not roleblocked if they visits witness's target (btw, what about transporters?), I think lookouts shouldn't be roleblocked either. And IMO witnesses shouldn¡t have astral visits.
BTW, I changed the alignment to Evil.


Responses to this Color.
Thanks for your feedback!
This is a very old post of mine.

The main problem with this role is that is NE but can win with town. NEs are supposed to be unable to harm town (jesters should be NB and exes are a bad NE, although I love playing as them). In my opinion, a better goal for witnesses would be "Survive to see the town lose the game", so they can't side with town.
Guess I'll just create a poll for that then. Cool :)


This is becoming a really fruitless argument. I am getting irritated. Atleast give some suggestions on how to change something other than backfiring it. Thank you.

I suggested some things. Also, I don't want to be rude, so if I sounded rude in my replies, sorry.
Sorry if I have spelling mistakes. English is not my main language.
I added a petition to my achievement rework!
Plese come and vote to support it!
If you have any suggestions related to achievements, please post them on my thread so we can suggest them together!
Also, support my suggestion about private lobbies!It would definitely increase the playerbase.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Arsonist
Arsonist
 
Posts: 2779
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Flare12332 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:38 pm

if the goal is to see 4 murders than it should not work so hard against the town and should be neutral benign
if is is to see the town lose then it's fine
Favorite Roles: Jester and Jailor
Hated role: Vampire

suggestion to existing game modes tell you lover's role
vigilante mode fixes
Possible Rotating game mode improvement

other ideas add a jugg to custom games
Invest should have a reason

this player please don't post on my threads MafiaMenace and nobody reply to this jerk ether if I'm the OP
Flare12332
Spy
Spy
 
Posts: 142
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 3:32 pm

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby BasicFourLife » Wed Dec 27, 2017 4:57 pm

It still triggers me that you did not change the Hex Master thing, but oh well.
I am kindly telling you to fuck off. Thank you.

FM / TG: 5 - 10 - 8
BasicFourLife
[Forum Mafia XVI] Winner
[Forum Mafia XVI] Winner
 
Posts: 1557
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 6:47 am
Location: UTC +2/+3 - Somewhere hidden

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Wed Dec 27, 2017 9:08 pm

BasicFourLife wrote:It still triggers me that you did not change the Hex Master thing, but oh well.


Wait... What? I thought I did... You mean the one if you witness a kill done my the Hex Master, they get a basic defense? Cause it's already there....

Sorry!

-------

Flare12332 wrote:if the goal is to see 4 murders than it should not work so hard against the town and should be neutral benign
if is is to see the town lose then it's fine


Okay.
Thanks for your feedback!

-------

The poll is on a draw right now and it dosn't have my vote since I want you guys to pick.
If there are any users browsing this thread, please vote aswell on the poll.

I appreciate your cooperation.
Thanks!

-------

Joacgroso wrote: Spoiler:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:Why is this role neutral evil if it can win with town?
Still working in the win conditions and goal. I don't really have to since I'm thinking it should just be NE.
Also, witnessing 4 kills is impossible.
Not so. Refer to the attributes.
How many times have you seen people predicting 4 kills in a game?
Well, as mostly a Doc main, it's a 80% chance for late game, 50% for mid game and 40% for early game to be able to predict who to kill.. Mostly, it depends on the player. This role shows them that they have to guess right or they delay their goal by one more night.


So...... What are you suggesting to change the goal to instead?

Or maybe change it's alignement to neutral benign.
See here, the Witness is hugely evil-sided since it can know who the killer is and the killer will just help the witness get more witnesses just so they wont be revealed.
But maybe I can balance the attributes a bit more
. He can also tell the town who the killers are so they don't kill him and he can witness vigilante/jailor kills, while evils would have to waste a night in order to get rid of him. Well, Town would just kill the Witness also since they can still have a chance to side with evils seeing the fact as they can give a buff. How many times have you seen Witch siding with Town then just getting hanged right after? Not to mention the evils wouldn't like that the Witness is siding with Town so they'd want to kill the Witness. Making you lose instantly. Lynching the witness would be pointless because he wouldn't be able to side with evils once he reveals. Everyone who whispered to him would be sus af. And there is a huge difference between witches and witnesses: Witches can't win with town. Witnesses can. Also, mafia don't have to kill witnesses because they are not town, so they wouldn't waste a kill on a neutral.
The main problem is that this role wouldn't affect the game at all.
Hmm.... I wonder why it's able to know who the killer is and is undetected by the Lookout, avoid Veteran aletts and WW mauls... (This is totally not here). Ok. That doesn't affect the game at all. What's the point of knowing who the killer is if you want to side with him? The only thing he would do is whisper to the killer to witness more kills, so if one of them dies then the other will be lynched. And if he tries to whisper to a NK and there is a bmer ingame, then the NK auto loses. And having astral visits doesn't make witnesses affect the game at all, unless they decide to reveal the killers and side with town.
Well, that's why the Witness dosn't get any defense. That's in-order to do so that the Witness should be able to find the killer more quicker.Sorry, I don't understand. What has being able to be killed and lose n1 to do with finding killers quickier? Not to mention there might be a Doc or BG protecting you. That depends of your fakeclaim. They would usually protect the jailor or any person who claimed a TPower role. Also, being protected n1 is a matter of luck. The Witness has no defense because their point is to give defense and if they think the killer will kill them, they would just side with Town, Vig and Jailor can still help on your goal. You just said they were evil sided and town would lynch them if they claim. And siding with town won't prevent them for dying either. And the point of whispering to someone is very risky.How are they supposed to guess 4 kills without whispering with the killer? The only thing that can make a Witness side with the killer is if they spam-vote the killer or if they whisper a very "strange" whisper seeing if there is a bmer in game. And getting the fact that every day, the killer would say who he would kill next just so that they would get a buff. That would make the Witness even more sus aswell as who they were whispering with. That's why I said they don't affect the game at all. They know who the killer is, but can't do anything about him except outing him in his last will if they die. WHAT CAN YOU SUGGEST THEN? --ahem-- Other than that, is there any way you can suggest to change it? You are the one suggesting the role, not me. You asked for feedback, so I told you what I think might be flaws. Maybe I'm wrong and these are not flaws, or maybe I'm right. But it's not my job to fix them if I have no better ideas. Honestly, the only things I can think are changing it's goal to "survive to see the town lose the game", giving them an autovest only for night 1, and making them only buff evils roles if they succesfully witness a kill. I'm not sure about astral visits, but I have no better ideas. Also, on a side note,
I think you should change the name of the role. "Witness" isn't evil enough in my opinion. I have no better ideas through. And something more: I think witnesses shouldn't have astral visits, since they are already detection immune. If they are caught by a smart lookout, it's their fault anyway.


It would be like a survivor.
Well, it can't defend itself seeing as the fact it can know who the killer is. Being granted 3 vests and being able to know who the killer is....... No.
And, Survivor can't know who is the killer unless they reveal themselves
. Since witness's goal is to witness 4 kills, that means that he auto losses if he dies in nights 1, 2, or 3. And with survivor I meant kingmaker who doesn't affect the game at all. Witnesses should have a scum autovest, just like witches. Maybe they should be able to watch themselves once if they still have the autovest.
The Witness can die in nights 1, 2 or 3. But by then, they would have already found the killer and the chances being killed in a 15-player game is in night 1,2 or 3, especially with a Townie confirming others would make you an unlikely target. But I do agree with the scum autovest tho. Ill consider that. Kills in night 1, and sometimes 2, are a matter of luck.
And how many times have you seen people correctly guessing a kill in the first 3 nights? This don't usually happens, especially if mafia isn't stupid and goes for obvious targets.
That goes on the luck of the player, then. Roles that are based on luck are bad ideas, especially if they are not NC. Since this role would be able to spawn in ranked, it shouldn't be luck-based (yes, I know that jesters can also die n1 and lose, but I think they shouldn't spawn in ranked anyway, and they should have basic defense for night 1 only. Amnesiacs too).

His ability is to passive to mess with town,
Any role that is a killing role specifically.
but it wouldn't work as NB because it would be too hard. Guessing 4 kills is impossible, especially if you have no defense at night.
Well, you can technically get 2 witnesses in 1 night by visiting a Lookout protected by a Bodyguard and attacked by a Mafioso. Unlikely af. Very likely in late game. Only if mafia is dumb enough to go for an obviously protected person. At that point the bg should have claimed if he was rt. And if he wasn't, attacking an obvious target would be suicidal. Also, surviving until lategame as evil, isn't that easy. Well, with the buff for the killing roles, it would be easy since the evil-killing roles can teak up and use theWitness as a buff. But, nonetheless, what can you suggest? Other than this useless argument. Also, if evils get the astral buff, then they will be bodyguard-immune, so witnessing this would be really hard in late game. And just because I don't have better ideas it doesn't mean that my argument is invalid.

That results to 2 deaths and since you were watching Lookout, you get 2 witnesses. Also goes for Vet and WW. You said that if he visits someone who dies to vet, it will count as a witness, so if they visit the vet they won't witness anything. If the Vet was vet-baiting, they would be able to witness something.Not to mention you can know who the Jailor is if they execute the target you were watching. I thought all visits failed on jailed targets.
But if he finds the jailor, he can just tell him who to execute and get other 2 witnesses.
The visits will fail on a JAILED target. But if it's an EXECUTE, it's successful. I didn't know that. So if a janitor cleans an executed person, he will be cleaned? I'm trying to implement a role that can affect a jailed person. Mafia and Evils aren't the same from their abilities. I'm also going for that because, lore-wise, the Witness can see the one who is jailed if they try to visit that person and, common sense, the Witness can see the jailed to be executed. And telling the Jailor who to execute can make the NK kill you instead Not if you whisper to the jailor or even the Jailor will execute you since your still Evil If they prefer wasting a kill on a Ne instead of killing a killer, then it's their problem.. Please read the attributes again. I can only see "Each night choose a player to gossip with". Read again. I did it. The only thing I don't like is that this role hardcounters lookouts. If TP are not roleblocked if they visits witness's target (btw, what about transporters?), I think lookouts shouldn't be roleblocked either. And IMO witnesses shouldn¡t have astral visits.
Witness can have astral visits if the TARGET died. So not all the time the Witness has astral visits.
The witnessing your TARGET to gain an astral visit for the current night is to prevent Lookout from being able to see you and confirm there is a Witness. However, if the target dosnt die, you wont gain an astral visit.

BTW, I changed the alignment to Evil.


Responses to this Color.
Thanks for your feedback!
This is a very old post of mine.

The main problem with this role is that is NE but can win with town. NEs are supposed to be unable to harm town (jesters should be NB and exes are a bad NE, although I love playing as them). In my opinion, a better goal for witnesses would be "Survive to see the town lose the game", so they can't side with town.
Guess I'll just create a poll for that then. Cool :)


This is becoming a really fruitless argument. I am getting irritated. Atleast give some suggestions on how to change something other than backfiring it. Thank you.

I suggested some things. Also, I don't want to be rude, so if I sounded rude in my replies, sorry.


Thanks for your feedback!
Also, you didn't sound rude it's just that I got irritated since you kept backfirinf everything I said
but I also do that soo..... It's alright lmao

-------

Can someone suggest a better name other than Witness? Cause it dosn't sound that evil honestly so......

Anyone?
Last edited by Flake on Fri Jun 29, 2018 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Multi-posts
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Joacgroso » Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:48 pm

Stalker?
Sorry if I have spelling mistakes. English is not my main language.
I added a petition to my achievement rework!
Plese come and vote to support it!
If you have any suggestions related to achievements, please post them on my thread so we can suggest them together!
Also, support my suggestion about private lobbies!It would definitely increase the playerbase.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Arsonist
Arsonist
 
Posts: 2779
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:21 am

Joacgroso wrote:Stalker?


I'll consider it and if I can't find a better name then I'll go for this one.
Thanks!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby BasicFourLife » Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:11 am

oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:Stalker?


I'll consider it and if I can't find a better name then I'll go for this one.
Thanks!


Isn't Stalker already one of the roles in Forum Mafia?

Maybe call it: The Shadow (it sounds edgy, but kind of cool)
I am kindly telling you to fuck off. Thank you.

FM / TG: 5 - 10 - 8
BasicFourLife
[Forum Mafia XVI] Winner
[Forum Mafia XVI] Winner
 
Posts: 1557
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 6:47 am
Location: UTC +2/+3 - Somewhere hidden

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:25 am

BasicFourLife wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Joacgroso wrote:Stalker?


I'll consider it and if I can't find a better name then I'll go for this one.
Thanks!


Isn't Stalker already one of the roles in Forum Mafia?

Maybe call it: The Shadow (it sounds edgy, but kind of cool)


I'll consider it.
Thanks for your feeback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Joacgroso » Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:51 am

Also, I don't think witnesses should be vet immune. If a vet manages to bait evils into him, he deserves to kill them.
And I also think that the autovest should give them basic defense, not powerful. if their goal is "survive to see the town lose", their vest should also protect them for douses and tell them someone tried to douse them. But it shouldn't protect them from vigis or vets, it should only protect them from scum imo.
Sorry if I have spelling mistakes. English is not my main language.
I added a petition to my achievement rework!
Plese come and vote to support it!
If you have any suggestions related to achievements, please post them on my thread so we can suggest them together!
Also, support my suggestion about private lobbies!It would definitely increase the playerbase.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Arsonist
Arsonist
 
Posts: 2779
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:22 am

Joacgroso wrote:Also, I don't think witnesses should be vet immune. If a vet manages to bait evils into him, he deserves to kill them.
Witness isn't vet-immune. He is only immune IF someone tried to kill the Veteran.
And I also think that the autovest should give them basic defense, not powerful. if their goal is "survive to see the town lose", their vest should also protect them for douses and tell them someone tried to douse them. But it shouldn't protect them from vigis or vets, it should only protect them from scum imo.
Noted.


Thanks for the feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Joacgroso » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:24 am

Would the killer die to the vet? Also, in special attributes says that they don't die to vets.
Sorry if I have spelling mistakes. English is not my main language.
I added a petition to my achievement rework!
Plese come and vote to support it!
If you have any suggestions related to achievements, please post them on my thread so we can suggest them together!
Also, support my suggestion about private lobbies!It would definitely increase the playerbase.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Arsonist
Arsonist
 
Posts: 2779
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:28 am

Joacgroso wrote:Would the killer die to the vet? Also, in special attributes says that they don't die to vets.


Yes, the killer would die to Vet but if the goal was to witness 4 kills, the vet killing the killer would also give you +1 witnesses.
But since the poll is on a draw, I can't do much about it. I don't want my own vote in the poll because I want the users scrolling through this thread to choose for themselves. I also don't want to vote because I'm the original poster.

And thanks for reminding me that I didnt specify when the witness wouldnt die to vet.
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Flare12332 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:14 pm

oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:Can someone suggest a better name other than Witness? Cause it dosn't sound that evil honestly so......

Anyone?

if it will be see 4 murders than it's fine as witness, if it's see the town lose, Death horseman of the apocalypse
Favorite Roles: Jester and Jailor
Hated role: Vampire

suggestion to existing game modes tell you lover's role
vigilante mode fixes
Possible Rotating game mode improvement

other ideas add a jugg to custom games
Invest should have a reason

this player please don't post on my threads MafiaMenace and nobody reply to this jerk ether if I'm the OP
Flare12332
Spy
Spy
 
Posts: 142
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 3:32 pm

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:53 pm

Flare12332 wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:Can someone suggest a better name other than Witness? Cause it dosn't sound that evil honestly so......

Anyone?

if it will be see 4 murders than it's fine as witness, if it's see the town lose, Death horseman of the apocalypse


Isn't the name a bit like Pestilence?
Or maybe I can have the role like PB. They have to achieve a goal then become Pest to kill everyone.
Should I make Witness something like that?
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Mystoc » Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:37 pm

Special Attributes: Ignore Werewolf Maul or Veteran Alert if you witness a kill done by them or someone trying to kill them.


what about ambusher medusa and pestilence? they also have kill visitor attacks but are from coven expansion

also if you scroll up a bit i have a post about the reworked role that you never responded too
User avatar
Mystoc
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 4:53 pm

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:59 am

Mystoc wrote:
Special Attributes: Ignore Werewolf Maul or Veteran Alert if you witness a kill done by them or someone trying to kill them.


what about ambusher medusa and pestilence? they also have kill visitor attacks but are from coven expansion
Okey
also if you scroll up a bit i have a post about the reworked role that you never responded too
Uh... Which one?


Thanks for the feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Mystoc » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:02 am

oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Mystoc wrote:
Special Attributes: Ignore Werewolf Maul or Veteran Alert if you witness a kill done by them or someone trying to kill them.


what about ambusher medusa and pestilence? they also have kill visitor attacks but are from coven expansion
Okey
also if you scroll up a bit i have a post about the reworked role that you never responded too
Uh... Which one?


Thanks for the feedback!


THIS

=========================================================

this is actually very good but it needs some changes at first i was like wait this NB its evil sided then i saw you changed it to NE

the buffs themselves may be OP but that can be balanced

this part i disagree with

> You will learn the killer's identity if the player you gossiped with dies.
> You cannot talk once you've witnessed 2 murders.


why?

first part makes the goal to ez just whisper the killer you are the witness and to tell you who they will kill next no risk with spy reworked, since they got a buff from you last night they know the witness was the there so its not you faking LO so they have no reason to distrust you at all to ez to win

remove the last part


why cant you talk? after you see two deaths if its NE town can just do a speak test if you cant you speak you get hanged


lastly town should get a debuff for visiting a person who was murdered while you were there since its an evil role now

maybe they cant do an action the next the night (like roleblocked?)
User avatar
Mystoc
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 4:53 pm

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:11 am

Mystoc wrote:
oOYuuArtSuiOo wrote:
Mystoc wrote:
Special Attributes: Ignore Werewolf Maul or Veteran Alert if you witness a kill done by them or someone trying to kill them.


what about ambusher medusa and pestilence? they also have kill visitor attacks but are from coven expansion
Okey
also if you scroll up a bit i have a post about the reworked role that you never responded too
Uh... Which one?


Thanks for the feedback!


THIS
Oh......

=========================================================

this is actually very good but it needs some changes at first i was like wait this NB its evil sided then i saw you changed it to NE
Why, thank you! :D

the buffs themselves may be OP but that can be balanced

this part i disagree with

> You will learn the killer's identity if the player you gossiped with dies.
Still considering some balancing for this.
> You cannot talk once you've witnessed 2 murders.
Already removed


why?

first part makes the goal to ez just whisper the killer you are the witness and to tell you who they will kill next no risk with spy reworked, since they got a buff from you last night they know the witness was the there so its not you faking LO so they have no reason to distrust you at all to ez to win
Hmmm.. Should I make it so that you know the ROLE which visited your target?

remove the last part
Done.


why cant you talk? after you see two deaths if its NE town can just do a speak test if you cant you speak you get hanged
Well... I want the role to have a side-effect like Witch. If Witch controls a Townie, they can say it to the Town. Confirming a Witch. But for Witness... There really isn't that much that can confirm the role otherwise than the roleblock some visitors if their target dies...

lastly town should get a debuff for visiting a person who was murdered while you were there since its an evil role now
Done.

maybe they cant do an action the next the night (like roleblocked?)
Yup that's what I implemented.


I think I probably read this and forgot to reply to it.
Thanks for your feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Mystoc » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:22 am

Hmmm.. Should I make it so that you know the ROLE which visited your target?


that's useless info it's just announced the next day how they died

======================================

name doesn't really fit

if feels to me lore wise

this dude witnessed a crime and is being payed off to look the other way sorta like a crooked cop or being threatened to keep quiet or the mafia will kill him either way he made a deal with the enemy

some names that kinda fit better are

here

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/conspirator

personally i like conspirator or collaborator better has a name
User avatar
Mystoc
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 4:53 pm

Re: The Witness (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:46 am

Mystoc wrote:
Hmmm.. Should I make it so that you know the ROLE which visited your target?


that's useless info it's just announced the next day how they died
Unless if the target didnt die like healed by Doctor or transported....
I'm still considering how I should change it because it sounds very Lookout-ish
Maybe have it a Psychic/Invest mesage like:
"You saw someone kill your target! It looks like they could be [Player A], [Player B] or [Player C]!

======================================

name doesn't really fit

if feels to me lore wise

this dude witnessed a crime and is being payed off to look the other way sorta like a crooked cop or being threatened to keep quiet or the mafia will kill him either way he made a deal with the enemy

some names that kinda fit better are

here

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/conspirator

personally i like conspirator or collaborator better has a name


Thanks for the feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Accomplice (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Mystoc » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:53 am

yea accomplice definitely fits better i would still remove knowing who killer is its kinda OP other then that i like the role a lot
User avatar
Mystoc
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 4:53 pm

Re: The Accomplice (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:10 am

Mystoc wrote:yea accomplice definitely fits better i would still remove knowing who killer is its kinda OP other then that i like the role a lot


Why thank you.
For the "knowing who fhe killer is", how do you think it should be changed?

I appreciate your time and effort for making this role achieve better standards!
Thanks for the feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Accomplice (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Joacgroso » Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:07 am

But if evil roles get astral visits due to the accomplice, does that mean that he won't be able to see them?
And what happens if they watch someone who was doused or incinerated?

Personally I can't support this role as NE if it can win with town. We already have 2 of them. This is especially needed in the coven expansion, where all NE can win with town.
And about the information problem: what if they can only know the name of the killer if they see him 2 times? Or if they don't know it at all and have to scumread to find their allies?
Sorry if I have spelling mistakes. English is not my main language.
I added a petition to my achievement rework!
Plese come and vote to support it!
If you have any suggestions related to achievements, please post them on my thread so we can suggest them together!
Also, support my suggestion about private lobbies!It would definitely increase the playerbase.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Arsonist
Arsonist
 
Posts: 2779
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: The Accomplice (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby oOYuuArtSuiOo » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:05 am

Joacgroso wrote:But if evil roles get astral visits due to the accomplice, does that mean that he won't be able to see them?
And what happens if they watch someone who was doused or incinerated?
I'll implement the answer here tomorrow cause it's like midnight here already lmao.

Personally I can't support this role as NE if it can win with town. We already have 2 of them. This is especially needed in the coven expansion, where all NE can win with town.
Well, that's what polls are for! :D
And about the information problem: what if they can only know the name of the killer if they see him 2 times? Or if they don't know it at all and have to scumread to find their allies?
I'll consider it.


Thanks for the feedback!
MY OTHER IDEAS!

The Taboo Caster (Coven Evil)
--------------------
Role Alignment Idea: The Equilibrium
--------------------
The Witness (Neutral Evil)

Shilster wrote:Isn't this just a better Janitor? It can totally disable people, and yeah, it nerfs lynching. People who can't vote (especially Town members) are useless to their team.

YuuArtSui explained it pretty well.

Aww, thanks :3

Image
User avatar
oOYuuArtSuiOo
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 10:17 pm
Location: Dat Booty

Re: The Accomplice (Neutral Evil) REWORKED!

Postby Mystoc » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:33 am

knowing the killer cant be allowed this role can reveal who evils are after it wins which is very bad since its goal isn't kill all town this wouldn't be gamethrowing at all which is very unfair to other evil roles

remove knowing who killer is please its just bad


also i would change it so the role can only witness evilpeople kill others towards counting towards its goal, cause town can kill too since this an evil role its goal should not benefit from town killing people this would give it the option to side with town late game since they can kill which is bad


i kinda view the lore of this role is its a guy who isn't pure evil and does not kill people, hes just the type of person who can be bribed to keep quite or justs want to stay alive so he looks the other way when he sees mafia and other killers killing town sorta like the have a understanding they wont kill him if he looks out for them and doesn't snitch

this role should not benefit from town killing people is my point since its an evil role
User avatar
Mystoc
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 4:53 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Role Ideas

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests