Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
timurtheking wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Yes but their 2 'special flowers' and this is for overall balance, I think its better to have this then a coven roleblocker or just in general a buff for witch. Instead of Witch claiming invest they can claim escort with ease/easier. With SK, yes escort/consort would of died while witch wouldn't but SK would know they were witched therefore knowing witch exists but they want witch alive anyway.
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Jailor's case is as rare as a blue moon. Both targets have to be exactly right for it to work.
It's a situational thing. Invest, Psy & Sheriff will know the day they're controlled, but so can any role that can be notified, like TP and Transporter. (wait, transporter is immune to both...)
You should also make it so the target is blind to all notifications if their ability succeeds, except RB-immune roles.
but a lot of these situations are rare like witch making doc heal someone from an attack etcBlackwolfe99 wrote:timurtheking wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Yes but their 2 'special flowers' and this is for overall balance, I think its better to have this then a coven roleblocker or just in general a buff for witch. Instead of Witch claiming invest they can claim escort with ease/easier. With SK, yes escort/consort would of died while witch wouldn't but SK would know they were witched therefore knowing witch exists but they want witch alive anyway.
Veteran, escort, transporter, doctor who successfully heals, BG who dies protecting someone, Investigators, Sheriff, LO who sees someone get visited, spy, VH who visits a vampire won't automatically make people realize there's a witch then?
It's not a horrible idea, but it's about as logical as the rb potion that people keep suggesting.
timurtheking wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Jailor's case is as rare as a blue moon. Both targets have to be exactly right for it to work.
It's a situational thing. Invest, Psy & Sheriff will know the day they're controlled, but so can any role that can be notified, like TP and Transporter. (wait, transporter is immune to both...)
You should also make it so the target is blind to all notifications if their ability succeeds, except RB-immune roles.
all notifications including stuff that happens to you like attacked but healed etc?
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
timurtheking wrote:but a lot of these situations are rare like witch making doc heal someone from an attack etcBlackwolfe99 wrote:timurtheking wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Yes but their 2 'special flowers' and this is for overall balance, I think its better to have this then a coven roleblocker or just in general a buff for witch. Instead of Witch claiming invest they can claim escort with ease/easier. With SK, yes escort/consort would of died while witch wouldn't but SK would know they were witched therefore knowing witch exists but they want witch alive anyway.
Veteran, escort, transporter, doctor who successfully heals, BG who dies protecting someone, Investigators, Sheriff, LO who sees someone get visited, spy, VH who visits a vampire won't automatically make people realize there's a witch then?
It's not a horrible idea, but it's about as logical as the rb potion that people keep suggesting.
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
kookeekwisp wrote:timurtheking wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Jailor's case is as rare as a blue moon. Both targets have to be exactly right for it to work.
It's a situational thing. Invest, Psy & Sheriff will know the day they're controlled, but so can any role that can be notified, like TP and Transporter. (wait, transporter is immune to both...)
You should also make it so the target is blind to all notifications if their ability succeeds, except RB-immune roles.
all notifications including stuff that happens to you like attacked but healed etc?
No, just the ones caused by you using your role's ability.
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
Blackwolfe99 wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:timurtheking wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Jailor's case is as rare as a blue moon. Both targets have to be exactly right for it to work.
It's a situational thing. Invest, Psy & Sheriff will know the day they're controlled, but so can any role that can be notified, like TP and Transporter. (wait, transporter is immune to both...)
You should also make it so the target is blind to all notifications if their ability succeeds, except RB-immune roles.
all notifications including stuff that happens to you like attacked but healed etc?
No, just the ones caused by you using your role's ability.
Basically the point I'm trying to make
Edit: Even with this, Witch just becomes buffed escort/consort.
timurtheking wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:timurtheking wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:I disagree, but I'm also considering something that I imagine was overlooked: Roleblock immune roles, Vigilante, and Jailor.
Roles like SK who kill roleblockers and roles who are immune to roleblock are going to instantly make this ineffective.
Then we go onto Vigilante or Jailor who get "roleblocked". In Vig's case a town member dies and they die from guilt the following night or in Jailor's case their target is executed despite the fact that they were "roleblocked".
Jailor's case is as rare as a blue moon. Both targets have to be exactly right for it to work.
It's a situational thing. Invest, Psy & Sheriff will know the day they're controlled, but so can any role that can be notified, like TP and Transporter. (wait, transporter is immune to both...)
You should also make it so the target is blind to all notifications if their ability succeeds, except RB-immune roles.
all notifications including stuff that happens to you like attacked but healed etc?
No, just the ones caused by you using your role's ability.
Basically the point I'm trying to make
Edit: Even with this, Witch just becomes buffed escort/consort.
If u think about it witch is already a 'buffed escort' controls are basicallt better roleblocks
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
kookeekwisp wrote:First off, delete old quotes in your post or put some in a spoiler.
Second, in what way is mind control WORSE than roleblocking?
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Blackwolfe99 wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:First off, delete old quotes in your post or put some in a spoiler.
Second, in what way is mind control WORSE than roleblocking?
First, You should see the other constantly requoted post discussions I've been in.
Second, I didn't say worse, in fact no one did. I'm saying that it's the same arguments used for deciding which is better for crowd control: Mind Control or Stun? Result almost always being that they have different uses.
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:kookeekwisp wrote:First off, delete old quotes in your post or put some in a spoiler.
Second, in what way is mind control WORSE than roleblocking?
First, You should see the other constantly requoted post discussions I've been in.
Second, I didn't say worse, in fact no one did. I'm saying that it's the same arguments used for deciding which is better for crowd control: Mind Control or Stun? Result almost always being that they have different uses.
That would imply that BOTH abilities have disadvantages to the other.
If one is in no way worse than the other, there's nothing it can't do that RBing can't do worse, so controlling is in every way better than roleblocking. Is that right?
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Blackwolfe99 wrote:Analyze pros and cons of both and tell me how controlling is better beyond knowing your target's role. (Which was a buff specifically made so Witch could find allies)
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
kookeekwisp wrote:Blackwolfe99 wrote:Analyze pros and cons of both and tell me how controlling is better beyond knowing your target's role. (Which was a buff specifically made so Witch could find allies)
Off the top of my head?
-Target can visit confirmed Veteran Only works if Vet alerts when you send them.
-You don't die to SK and WW Granted, but if WW gets roleblocked Witch is fucked.
-Can make any TP protect you If there are any.
-Force a Vigilante to shoot someone AND themselves True, happens more often than not.
-Make Jailor execute a Townie This is so rare, it really doesn't apply.
Oh i can go on.
EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW
/support
Kirize wrote:I didnt know you could contradict yourself in one sentencekookeekwisp wrote:Dont single out Arso cause it kills slower!
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