Jerme wrote:I wonder which bugs are/will be fixed. Can you elaborate a bit further, or note the major fixes?
Kirize12 wrote:Honestly, I don't believe this rolelist will work out. Town doesnt start with majority as it should (there should be a minimum of 10 Town, relying on Mafia and NK's Killing each other is not how a competitive game should be played) and there are FOUR COVEN ROLES all of which have the ability to kill more or less. Medusa/Poisoner/Potion Master would be a nightmare in comparison to Necromancer/Hex Master/Potion Master. Here is my ideal list:
Mayor/Jailor/Trapper
Town Investigative
Town Protective
Town Protective
Town Killing
Town Support
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Coven
Random Coven
Random Coven
Amnesiac
With all the Coven roles that can kill it makes sense to include two protectives, and makes no sense to include a Neutral Killing role since there could potentially be four kills per night. With all that claimspace town will have to rely solely on themselves to win the game, and VFR is more or less nullified, something a lot of players want, and it enforces scumreading, which is good for the game. Including Amnesiac makes sense in case a Coven member dies early given its new fix, NE just serves no purpose in the game, NK would add too many kills, and Any would just be swingy - imagine the shift from Retributionist to serial Killer. Not to mention the unfairety of a lone mafia member.
WittyRecluse wrote:Kirize12 wrote:Honestly, I don't believe this rolelist will work out. Town doesnt start with majority as it should (there should be a minimum of 10 Town, relying on Mafia and NK's Killing each other is not how a competitive game should be played) and there are FOUR COVEN ROLES all of which have the ability to kill more or less. Medusa/Poisoner/Potion Master would be a nightmare in comparison to Necromancer/Hex Master/Potion Master. Here is my ideal list:
Mayor/Jailor/Trapper
Town Investigative
Town Protective
Town Protective
Town Killing
Town Support
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Town
Random Coven
Random Coven
Random Coven
Amnesiac
With all the Coven roles that can kill it makes sense to include two protectives, and makes no sense to include a Neutral Killing role since there could potentially be four kills per night. With all that claimspace town will have to rely solely on themselves to win the game, and VFR is more or less nullified, something a lot of players want, and it enforces scumreading, which is good for the game. Including Amnesiac makes sense in case a Coven member dies early given its new fix, NE just serves no purpose in the game, NK would add too many kills, and Any would just be swingy - imagine the shift from Retributionist to serial Killer. Not to mention the unfairety of a lone mafia member.
There's only an average of about 2 kills per night I believe, correct? In that case, with your set-up, day two is going to be at 10v3 at worst, because with this set-up, there is no reason whatsoever for amnesiac to go evil. With those numbers, there is no incentive for evils to be active; instead, they have to rely on Town being stupid and mislynching each other - which could happen based on that amount of RT, and that is not what should be happening in a competetive setup.
There's literally no way coven can win with that set-up due to the confirmability of town roles. Town would have so much margin for error that vig could even random shoot just to confirm himself.
I can understand maybe having guarranteed 9 town given the killing power of coven, but then it should be something like
Jailor
TI
TI
TS
TK
TP
RT
RT
RT
CL
RC
RC
NK
NE
NB
Kirize12 wrote:Witty, the Coven ranges from zero kills per night (until they get the Necronomicon) to 3 if the right setup rolls. You're forgetting my setup has five random Town, meaning scum have unlimited claimspace. Due to the killing power of the Coven, day 2 would be, on average, 9v3 even with no NK. Coven is very swingy to balance since like I said it can have no kills per night until they get the Necronomicon or have 3 KPN starting N1. But Town should have both a majority and claimspace, meaning player skill is the sole factor that determines the winner, not having to rely on other teams Killing each other or being confirmed via PoE.
Kirize12 wrote:Witty, the Coven ranges from zero kills per night (until they get the Necronomicon) to 3 if the right setup rolls. You're forgetting my setup has five random Town, meaning scum have unlimited claimspace. Due to the killing power of the Coven, day 2 would be, on average, 9v3 even with no NK. Coven is very swingy to balance since like I said it can have no kills per night until they get the Necronomicon or have 3 KPN starting N1. But Town should have both a majority and claimspace, meaning player skill is the sole factor that determines the winner, not having to rely on other teams Killing each other or being confirmed via PoE.
Krishna101 wrote:Alright, I am extremely surprised that changes to a spy have not been announced in this patch. The spy has become the most trash town role because the developers thought nerfing it a hundred times would make the role better for the game. Why not just remove it if you hate it so much? Or, if you really want to fix it, let it hear whispers but not read the mafia chat at all. After all, you developers completely crushed the spy with the mafia-knows update. Why bother having the role listen to the mafia chat if the mafia chat can't talk info at all? In every game I play as a spy, all I would EVER hear from the mafia chat would be "hi spy" and then no more talk for the rest of the game. Now forget about criticism, let's talk problem-fixing. Making the spy able to hear whispers helps confirm the spy, and without it, the spy will not be able to confirm itself at all. Also, having the blackmailer be the only role to read whispers? REALLY? Nerfing the spy's whisper capability buffs the blackmailer automatically since mafia now knows town's whispers, and the town won't whisper clues at all with a blackmailer around. Spies were meant to hear whispers from town to gather clues for other town members like the jailor, but now all the clues they get are the most useless ones. 2nd fix: get rid of mafia/coven knowing about the spy and let spy not read mafia/coven chat. If you truly want to balance the spy, that is your best option. Do nothing, and watch the committing suicide rates rise for people roleplaying as a spy. All you are doing by nerfing the role is by making people hate it even more, which I'm sure you don't want.
Krishna101 wrote:Making the spy able to hear whispers helps confirm the spy, and without it, the spy will not be able to confirm itself at all.
PyromonkeyGG wrote:Various Bug Fixes
We have fixed many bugs and typos with this patch. If you encounter a bug, or a typo, please make sure to let us know!
StormFighter wrote:Well, in my opinion, ranked practice was better and more exciting before this patch. I just played in the new patch, and we had 3 investigators (including me) and all we did is whispered to each other about others' identity, but we didn't really had a role in the match. Mafia easily got it. So... overall, i think the version before this, was better.
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