"Spam", or strategical communications?

Post anything related to the game here!

"Spam", or strategical communications?

Postby cob709 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:27 pm

TL DR: Spamming rule is bad and prevent strategic gameplay. Add an exception to the rule.

-----
Juror Guide's Definition of Spam
Image
-----

Due to the moderation and rules that dictate what "spam" is considered to be, many viable strategies are extremely limited due to the fact that freedom of speech is extremely limited and restricted.

Many information gathering and manipulation tactics such as exclusion or claiming is impossible due to the spamming rule, which heavily cripples gameplays. Strategies that are time/message based are impossible, or the success is very limited due to the rule.

For example: As a suiciding member of the mafia, they claim Jailor Day 1, and then throughout Day 2, ask for roles. This is typically quicker when players are whispered for their roles. Eventually, the mafia will be executed by the real jailor, but they will be able to force the town to mass claim, and expose important roles such as retributionist, veteran, or vigilante. Though, this strategy is not fully reliable due to the fact that they cannot whisper to more than 4 players each day for their claims, and they only get one day to utilize this strategy. By removing the spam restriction, they are able to communicate with their mafia members, and still disguise it under the premise of asking for claims.

Another example: As a leading town, they claim Sheriff/Vigilante on Day 1, and then ask for roles throughout the rest of the game. Once again, it is likely they will be jailed. However, this is less of a problem, since they have more time to ask for roles. However, the spam restriction greatly slows town from progressing and asking for claims because it usually takes a whole day for everyone to coordinate a "VFR"(Vote For Role), whilst one very active player can get everyone to claim Day 2, but they aren't allowed to do so because of the spam rule.

In both examples, a very experienced player is unable to speed up the progress of the game due to this game-breaking rule. Although the rule is indeed necessary, it also has poor moderation. Since Town of Salem entirely revolves around information manipulation and communication, players should be allowed to do so more flexibly. Of course, the spamming role is in place to enforce true spammers and trolls. However, it disrupts to functions of regular and honest players.

To prevent actual spammers from stopping the game entirely, and to also allow players to act more flexibly, a compromise must be in place. One solution to both these issues is to add an "exception" to the rule. Such as allowing repeating messages IF they progress the game forward, and are not an obvious attempt at clogging up the chat.

In conclusion, the definition of spamming is too broad, and inflexible, which causes levels of gameplay to decrease, and either faction are unable to act quicker and play optimally. One way of solving this problem is to allow repeating messages that progress the game forward.
User avatar
cob709
Retributionist
Retributionist
 
Posts: 373
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:44 am

Re: "Spam", or strategical communications?

Postby Brilliand » Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:57 pm

Counterargument: Any strategy that involves breaking the "no spam" rule is too chaotic for Town of Salem. There's only ~30 seconds per phase; that isn't enough to support strategies that involve whispering the same thing to everyone.
My best role ideas:
Conqueror
Apocalypse Survivor
User avatar
Brilliand
Blackmailer
Blackmailer
 
Posts: 1162
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2014 8:34 pm

Re: "Spam", or strategical communications?

Postby cob709 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 11:08 pm

Brilliand wrote:Counterargument: Any strategy that involves breaking the "no spam" rule is too chaotic for Town of Salem. There's only ~30 seconds per phase; that isn't enough to support strategies that involve whispering the same thing to everyone.

Rebuttal: Whispering players for games only distribute the message to 1 player per message. If they wanted to ask roles from more than 5 players, it will count as spam. It is not necessarily chaotic, as it doesn't disrupt the flow of chat UNLESS a large body of text is sent. Additionally, during the time prior to the discussion phase, players are only able to communicate via whispers. So it is a viable strategy to chat using the whisper system, however, this is also not allowed with the current rules due to the spam regulation.
Image
User avatar
cob709
Retributionist
Retributionist
 
Posts: 373
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:44 am

Re: "Spam", or strategical communications?

Postby wozearly » Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:55 am

cob709 wrote:
Brilliand wrote:Counterargument: Any strategy that involves breaking the "no spam" rule is too chaotic for Town of Salem. There's only ~30 seconds per phase; that isn't enough to support strategies that involve whispering the same thing to everyone.

Rebuttal: Whispering players for games only distribute the message to 1 player per message. If they wanted to ask roles from more than 5 players, it will count as spam. It is not necessarily chaotic, as it doesn't disrupt the flow of chat UNLESS a large body of text is sent. Additionally, during the time prior to the discussion phase, players are only able to communicate via whispers. So it is a viable strategy to chat using the whisper system, however, this is also not allowed with the current rules due to the spam regulation.


Rebuttal Rebuttal: I've never come across anyone claming Jailor being accused of spamming for whispering "role?" to five separate players to invite them to claim to them privately. It is incredibly unlikely that any players would have reported you for spamming in this instance, and even less likely that a judge would uphold it as spamming. Meanwhile, openly saying "I'm Jailor. Everyone whisper roles to me" gets you to the same place (on paper) without needing to use the same message. You could also ask for claims from multiple players (e.g. "1-4, claim ahead of VFR please...") or vary the language you use "role?" "role pls" "your role?" if you want to stick to the absolute letter of the rules.

I don't see it as a good argument for changing the underlying definition of spamming.


PS. In higher ELO games, Town typically wait a bit at the start of D2 to see if there are any Jailor counterclaims and/or ask the Jailor claimant to announce who they jailed before they start sharing their roles in whispers (see: claiming Jailor D1 does not necessarily make you Jailor).

Any counterclaims or challenges will silence Town members who would not have openly revealed on D2 in any case. So the suicidal mafia member might not get very much back from their frantic whispers, and would simply be executed for their troubles at the end of D2.

PPS. Never, ever claim Vigi on Day 1 unless you're in a roleset where Witch/CL can't roll. The remaining Town will not approve.
PPPS. I've never known an unconfirmed Sheriff have a need to ask for other people's roles, so that would also strike me as highly suspicious.
wozearly
Sheriff
Sheriff
 
Posts: 582
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:48 am


Return to Town of Salem Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests