SK died to BG when SK was jailed

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SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby iago18 » Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:01 am

Hi all,

So I was SK and jailed n1. I attacked the jailor, obviously, but I don't think SK should die to BG when BG is on jailor. It just makes it that much harder to win as NK... It's bad enough trying to trick the jailor, but then to lose to BG when jailed just feels wrong.

Hopefully this can change in the future. Post any thoughts about this below.

Thanks you.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby kyuss420 » Wed Jan 22, 2020 3:11 am

that sucks, and weird mechanic, if its intentional... SK should really have an astral attack (attack without visiting) while in jail. Maybe post in the bugs section to confirm its intentional?
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby MissAlanius » Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:55 am

SK dying to BG when he's jailed makes perfect sense to me.

Think about it. The bodyguard is guarding the jailor. He's not going to just turn his back on the jailor while the jailor interrogates the SK, he's going to focus on protecting him even if he doesn't see the danger and execute SK.

SK doesn't get to be magical with his knives.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby kyuss420 » Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:19 am

MissAlanius wrote:SK dying to BG when he's jailed makes perfect sense to me.

Think about it. The bodyguard is guarding the jailor. He's not going to just turn his back on the jailor while the jailor interrogates the SK, he's going to focus on protecting him even if he doesn't see the danger and execute SK.

SK doesn't get to be magical with his knives.


Yea, but BG protects from visiting attackers. LO doesnt see who is jailed, because its not a visit, technically the SK didnt visit the jailor, so the BG shouldnt protect
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Flavorable » Thu Jan 23, 2020 6:29 am

I've checked in with the Devs and this is intentional behavior.

BG only doesn't protect their target from a passive attack, but SK/WW being jailed, not executed and then attacking the jailor is an active attack.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby orangeandblack5 » Mon Feb 03, 2020 7:25 am

Flavorable wrote:I've checked in with the Devs and this is intentional behavior.

BG only doesn't protect their target from a passive attack, but SK/WW being jailed, not executed and then attacking the jailor is an active attack.

Well that's dumb

It's literally completely out of your control and also extremely likely the Jailor is protected
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that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby ElleJoy » Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:27 pm

Should fix it so killing jailor n1 as SK is optional. It's stupid that you die to BG n1 because you had no choice but to attack the jailor when that might not be remotely what you planned. It's basically a useless role in that context - esp with d1 meta being effectively the norm, now.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:54 am

Intuitively, it would make more sense for the SK counterattacks against Jailor and Escort to both be classified as passive attacks.

Is the SK killed if he's roleblocked by an escort who's protected by a bodyguard?
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby orangeandblack5 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:35 am

Oh no he probably is

At this point this really ought to be a Bug Report not a suggestion

Honestly can't believe this is allegedly intended
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SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:39 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:Oh no he probably is


I just tested. The results weren't completely conclusive, but after a bodyguard ragequit with no will after the escort he was told to protect died... I'm pretty sure it's the escort who dies in this situation.

So Escort works differently from Jailor in this regard. (Jailor should be changed to work like Escort for this purpose, imo.)
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Flavorable » Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:25 am

Brilliand wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:Oh no he probably is


I just tested. The results weren't completely conclusive, but after a bodyguard ragequit with no will after the escort he was told to protect died... I'm pretty sure it's the escort who dies in this situation.

So Escort works differently from Jailor in this regard. (Jailor should be changed to work like Escort for this purpose, imo.)


The difference is that the escort's active roleblock makes a person stay home, making it a passive attack, whereas the jailor jailing the SK pulls him from his home, making it an active attack. It works the same for the WW.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby orangeandblack5 » Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:20 am

What does a Lookout see if they watch the Jailor and the Escort when this all happens?
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SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:06 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:What does a Lookout see if they watch the Jailor and the Escort when this all happens?


Nothing. I'm sure I've seen this happen before, and the Lookout does not see the jailed SK. (And of course the Lookout will not see the roleblocked SK either.)
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Superalex11 » Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:43 pm

orangeandblack5 wrote:At this point this really ought to be a Bug Report not a suggestion

No those aren't allowed anymore
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:26 pm

Superalex11 wrote:
orangeandblack5 wrote:At this point this really ought to be a Bug Report not a suggestion

No those aren't allowed anymore


I can sort of understand only accepting bug reports about new features, not ancient bugs that the community has tolerated for years.

The devs are busy, they can't be spending their time on trivial problems.
Last edited by Brilliand on Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Superalex11 » Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:44 pm

Brilliand wrote:The devs are busy, they can't be spending their time on trivial problems.


shapesifter13 wrote:IMPROVEMENTS
• General - Lightened the hue of the Serial Killer blue role color as it was often too dark to easily read.
• Account Creation - Added some more specific feedback on why a username is not allowed.
• General - Feedback is now provided after correctly solving a captcha.
• Game - Last Will - For consistency with Notes, moved the Send Will to Chat button to the bottom right corner.
• Game - Increased middle scroll button speed on chat box history.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:24 pm

Superalex11 wrote:
Brilliand wrote:The devs are busy, they can't be spending their time on trivial problems.


shapesifter13 wrote:IMPROVEMENTS
• General - Lightened the hue of the Serial Killer blue role color as it was often too dark to easily read.
• Account Creation - Added some more specific feedback on why a username is not allowed.
• General - Feedback is now provided after correctly solving a captcha.
• Game - Last Will - For consistency with Notes, moved the Send Will to Chat button to the bottom right corner.
• Game - Increased middle scroll button speed on chat box history.


These are all client-side problems that came up in the process of debugging the Unity port, which is a recent feature and a massive project to boot. Therefore a fine example of:

Brilliand wrote:only accepting bug reports about new features
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby orangeandblack5 » Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:46 pm

Hot take

Bugs should be fixed

Age is irrelevant
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SwampRabbit wrote:your idea is that no town should ever be able to confirm themselves as town.

that is the dumbest idea I think I have heard.

ElderSivart wrote:I'm confused as to why BMG made a UI for Pirate and not Hypnotist.

Sarah Thorpe wrote:Role Ideas is great for masochists.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Superalex11 » Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:48 pm

Brilliand wrote:
Superalex11 wrote:
Brilliand wrote:The devs are busy, they can't be spending their time on trivial problems.


shapesifter13 wrote:IMPROVEMENTS
• General - Lightened the hue of the Serial Killer blue role color as it was often too dark to easily read.
• Account Creation - Added some more specific feedback on why a username is not allowed.
• General - Feedback is now provided after correctly solving a captcha.
• Game - Last Will - For consistency with Notes, moved the Send Will to Chat button to the bottom right corner.
• Game - Increased middle scroll button speed on chat box history.


These are all client-side problems that came up in the process of debugging the Unity port, which is a recent feature and a massive project to boot. Therefore a fine example of:

Brilliand wrote:only accepting bug reports about new features


Brilliand wrote:The devs are busy, they can't be spending their time on trivial problems.


Brilliand wrote:trivial


Are you really gonna sit here and argue that a gameplay mechanic is too trivial to worry about, yet things like text color and button positioning are not?
...Not to mention all the other recent additions that in no way go towards "getting the Unity version out of beta"_TM, such as new skins and the chat filter.


Look, I understand the devs are working towards some elusive goal, but every time someone defends their explicit inaction on actually important issues, BMG is only further justified in their inaction by the fact that the people who play their game don't care. Town of Salem deserves better. Stop defending mediocrity and incompetence.
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Re: SK died to BG when SK was jailed

Postby Brilliand » Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:05 pm

Superalex11 wrote:Are you really gonna sit here and argue that a gameplay mechanic is too trivial to worry about, yet things like text color and button positioning are not?
...Not to mention all the other recent additions that in no way go towards "getting the Unity version out of beta"_TM, such as new skins and the chat filter.


Nah, I misspoke. "Trivial" is not precisely what I meant.

But figuring out exactly what I meant can be an exercise for the reader, 'cause it's not worth bogging down the thread with this.

I think kyuss said all that needed to be said in the 4th post:

kyuss420 wrote:Yea, but BG protects from visiting attackers. LO doesnt see who is jailed, because its not a visit, technically the SK didnt visit the jailor, so the BG shouldnt protect


So, even if the devs intentionally coded it this way... they probably shouldn't have done that.
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