The Scientist (Town Investigative) (Used in Testing Grounds)

[Exacerbated]

The Parity Cop fills a niche: it provides information at the macro-level, the relationship between one player and the next.

The information about associations and interactions is far more valuable than information about a single person's alignment, but it isn't as definitive and certain as a singular check on one player.

It is stronger than a Sheriff/Investigator in certain situations while being worse in others.

I'd say the power level is similar to the rest of the TI squad; it simply provides different information than the others.

The Spy attempts to do this, but the Spy's game design is toxic and spoon feeds the player while trivializing the game.

[AgenteFuego]

I like this role, one of the best Town Investigate suggestions I've seen. However, I think you need to fix the way it interacts with the Framer, Witch and Transporter. Sure, those roles can affect the other Town Investigatives too, however, they would only ruin one result per visit.

Because The Scientist's result of his current night depends on the result he got last night, one visit from either of these 3 roles is enough to ruin his whole stream of investigations.

My suggestions to fix this problem would be:

1-Making him immune to being controlled.
2- Whenever he tries to check a Framed target, he will get a message that something went wrong and that he needs to start all over again. This actually helps the Framer by delaying the Scientist, and the Scientist is still able to keep investigating correctly later.
3-Same thing for Transporter: whenever the Scientist visits a transported target, he will get a message that something went wrong and that he needs to start all over again.
This gives the Transporter even more reason to do not transport randomly.

[BPsycho2]

So, Framer should fool this Scientist TWICE with one successfull frame?


Honestly, I think it should just fail.

[TheWolfBuddy]

Lore wise I have no clue why papers would mess up skin/hair/whatever samples or people saying who the person hangs out with or whatever.

Balance-wise?

Framer is awful and needs something more to do. Leave framer as is.

[AgenteFuego]

Let Framer trick it. It buffs it.

Lore wise I have no clue why papers would mess up skin/hair/whatever samples or people saying who the person hangs out with or whatever.

Balance-wise?

Framer is awful and needs something more to do. Leave framer as is.

Balance-wise I agree that the Framer needs a buff, but you don't buff a role by giving it another role it can affect: you improve on its abilities or give him a new one.

Also, lore-wise, just because the Framer's icon is a paper/photograph, and the fact that he's good at forging documents, dosn't mean that's all he uses to frame people, otherwise we would have to believe that the Janitor just passes a mop over it's target's corpse/house and that gets rid of any evidence on its identity. There are tons of ways to frame people, with the Scientist, I assume the Framer breaks into its laboratory and switches samples. The target he picks at night is just the one he's intending to frame.

So, Framer should fool this Scientist TWICE with one successfull frame?


Honestly, I think it should just fail.

Not only that, all his others results would be wrong too. Yes, let it fail.

[Adreamcar222]

THIS ROCKS AND SHOULD BE PUT IN TESTING GROUNDS!

[TheMightyEagle]

Fantastic. The OP/UPness of it depends on the player. Fantastic.

[Deaky04]

One of the best roles I have seen. Plz BMG add it in 1.5/1.6

[TemporalFuzz]

I like it, I just think the scientist should be able to select 2 in one night, rather than a slow two night process.
The two night process makes the scientist worse than a sheriff or an investigator, because it takes two nights to reveal two mafia or town.

[orangeandblack5]

That actually makes it better. You have to be a better player and can't just auto-find scum or innocents each night, completely seperately from the rest of your targets.

[cchough123]

To avoid framers really screwing with scientists, and since as a scientist based on logic he would be using actual DNA instead of planted evidence, could the Scientist be worked to ignore framed status? I feel like that would balance framer-scientist games and not give framer such a massive advantage in that game.

[ok98161]

For the consigliere results, I think it would make more sense to say "Your target compares people." Because all investigatives could have a thirst for knowledge. But I think it is a really cool role. The only thing I could think of that would be a HUGE con would be if it showed up in classic... It would be a possibilty with the random town in classic.

[BlazinIce]

Great role- it's just: If jester (and/or exe) is dead, and the scientist studies a spy/jailor one night (or other conformed townies), and someone else the other night, both of them are either
a) also conformed
b) lynched by the next day
It's great, I just think if you know one person's role, you can easily test the role, making it instant lynches. Besides, there's little chance that the framer will correctly mess with the right person.

[WindBlqde]

This is cool! I like the idea. Hope to see more from you.

[Damafaud]

This thread is posted last year, but this is still one of the best role I've seen. Like it said, it can potentially clean 2 people at once. But it also have a big chance to mess up if there is a Transporter in town. If the Scientist sample someone that is transed, he will waste 2 night; One because he sample someone transed and a second night because he compare a new sample with the sample from someone he doesn't know who.

[Cenas4life]

I think this role is a VERY VERY interesting concept. The only problem I have with it is that it would require a high skill level to play as (which I have, but others might not.) Besides that I think the role is very intriguing. /Support

[Idobadstuff]

I think that this role would add something really interesting to the mix /support!

[JudgeFiach]

Complex, but reasonably so. A town investigative that requires actual planning rather than just "Oh hey that guy is suspicious, let's just throw an investigation his way and oh, would you look at that, he's mafia."

Potentially outs several mafia but must only be used by someone who actually knows what to do and keep track of who is who

[EmeraldDS]

This actually has great potential. Let's say a Sheriff interrogates a Mafia member (not GF) and they're revealed as such, and then Sheriff whispers to the Scientist, as well as Invest. Invest could find out what Mafia role they are. If they're a less useful role, it might be worth keeping them alive as a sample to find other Mafia with the Scientist and bam—that's now a great incentive for Townie teamwork.

/full support

I like the role and the idea. I had a similar idea a while ago where instead of alignments, it was based off of whether that player could win with the other player still alive. Which could be useful as a nerf.

For example you roll a scientist
n1 - sample a mayor - no result
n2 - sample a survivor - result of can win with eachother alive
n3 - sample a mafioso - result of can win with eachother alive
d3 - mayor reveals - you think the people you invested n2 and n3 are inno because of mayor

With this nerf implemented, the scientists results could also be unaffected by framers.

With this a scientist could also find jesters like so:
n1 - jester - no result
n2 - jester - can't win with this person alive

Roles like exe can win with everyone alive except their target.

As cool as that would be, honestly, I think that it would be far too OP. A confirmed Townie/Mafia who is sampled is powerful enough—with this, the Scientist might as well be a Townie Consig.

[vitorsly]

Great role, best I read in these forums. I support!

[orangeandblack5]

bumpity

[TheFieryLord]

This is a really cool rule, but if there is revealed Mayor wouldn't that just be a recipe for disaster for the Mafia? Scientist can compare Mayor to anyone and confirm townies and scout out Mafia.

[gamer0]

this seems like a really tricky role, but it does seem like with enough practice, this role can just lead to this every game:






TOWN WINS

[IndiguanaYT]

An interesting idea, however it would need testing as it would require a lot of concentration and skill to use it effectively. If approved, maybe it should remain in only custom games and ranked? I can see it confusing a lot of people if it was to be included in ranked practice.

[HereThereEverywhere]

An interesting idea, however it would need testing as it would require a lot of concentration and skill to use it effectively. If approved, maybe it should remain in only custom games and ranked? I can see it confusing a lot of people if it was to be included in ranked practice.

How would they learn how to use the role in Ranked if it's not in Ranked Practice?