Trans should not change jester guilt

[Mathelete]

The whole point of a jester is to punish someone who fell for your trap. If a transporter can make jester kill an abstainer or an inno voter, it defeats the whole purpose of a jester. In my opinion, nothing should be able to stop a jester kill. After all, nothing can stop a vig from dying of guilt after shooting a townie (unless transporter can change that guilt too, but I would hope not). Now I can agree with transporter switching guilt between two guilty voters, but not between a guilty and an abstainer/inno'er.

Thoughts on this matter?

[benjiboo267]

/support

seems kinda cheap that a trans could guilty on jester knowing he could not die, or tell another townie the same thing... basically free kill for town when there's a trans

[Stolith]

Honestly didn't know this was a thing. I do agree though.

[Ogeezalo]

I have seen a lot of town wins because of this mechanic. It really is infuriating, especially when you are the evil who didn't fall for it but suffer anyway.

[Parallax7]

I think Transporter should be able to. It makes scum thinks twice before lynching the Jester.

By the way, if Jester doesn't select someone to haunt, transporting doesn't work, and the person is determined by RNG. So don't pick to haunt anyone.

[Mathelete]

I think Transporter should be able to. It makes scum thinks twice before lynching the Jester.

By the way, if Jester doesn't select someone to haunt, transporting doesn't work, and the person is determined by RNG. So don't pick to haunt anyone.

That makes even less sense, so if the Jester lets the game pick randomly, transportation doesn't work? Sounds like a bug to me. But the way I see it, the purpose of Jester is to make all players think twice before voting guilty on someone suspicious. If you voted inno, you should be in the clear no matter what.

[Daizy]

Definitely for people who inno the Jester. Not so sure about Abstainers, but there again people just tend to Abstain and if they all voted inno the poor Jester wouldn't get the win. I'm not even sure what I'm saying. But yeah, transporter shouldn't be able to transport the guilt. I know balance > lore but how could you feel so guilty you got haunted on a death that you didn't even help happen just because someone switches you around in a wagon? And gameplay wise, it just isn't that fair. So /support this.

[ScardyBob]

By the way, if Jester doesn't select someone to haunt, transporting doesn't work, and the person is determined by RNG. So don't pick to haunt anyone.

I always thought that this was the stupidest thing. Either trans should be able to trans guilty or they should not. Only being able to trans guilt when the jester picks a target is both confusing and buggy.

[Parallax7]

Currently Jester is Neutral Evil, and it shouldn't be, because it isn't anti-town. So if it were to be changed, if it's lynched, one town member will be haunted. No matter what, but the Transportert may attempt to transport guilt. However, scum cannot be haunted under normal circumstance. Essentially give Jester a mega-haunt determined by Executioner's RNG.

In short, if Jester is lynched, own member of the town will be haunted, regardless of: guilty, innocent, or abstaining.'Jester may not choose, so his(her/other) haunt will be determined by Executioner's RNG. E.G only member's of town's faction can be harmed.

That'd be great because it'd put it on par with the other Neutral Evils in terms of their effect on the game. Pro-Scum, Anti-Town.

Problem solved. Two birds one stone.

[snapshot112]

Transporting the guilt from a jester actually makes a lot of sense: The jester goes to someone's house to make the guy in that house suicide, The transporter can switch the person who is supposed to be in that house with someone else, resulting in the jester accidentically haunting the wrong person.

sorry, but /NoSupport

[chitownmvp01]

Transporting the guilt from a jester actually makes a lot of sense: The jester goes to someone's house to make the guy in that house suicide, The transporter can switch the person who is supposed to be in that house with someone else, resulting in the jester accidentically haunting the wrong person.

sorry, but /NoSupport

It logically makes sense. I agree. It should stay as is. If you are transed into guilt, perhaps you should have done more to stop the town from lynching the Jester.

/no support

[DaewnoftheGamer]

I agree!! Trans should have no power over the jester, it ruins the role!!

[Parallax7]

I agree!! Trans should have no power over the jester, it ruins the role!!

Why is that?

[FrankLeeAwful]

Yeah, I don't support this. It's been a mechanic for long enough already that it shouldn't be changed now.

[Emberguard]

No. Just No.

Transporter is designed to swap targets. Jester is still targeting someone. It adds to the strategy for both town and mafia. I don't see how it can ruin the role when the role already won the game. If anything the fact the Jester has won the game and doesn't have any living allies would make it arguable as to whether or not the Jester should have the right to interfere with the game through their haunt in the first place.

[FrankLeeAwful]

Transporting the guilt from a jester actually makes a lot of sense: The jester goes to someone's house to make the guy in that house suicide, The transporter can switch the person who is supposed to be in that house with someone else, resulting in the jester accidentically haunting the wrong person.

sorry, but /NoSupport

It logically makes sense. I agree. It should stay as is. If you are transed into guilt, perhaps you should have done more to stop the town from lynching the Jester.

/no support

Obviously you can play around it to some extent, but is that fun from a gameplay perspective?

It doesn't make sense at all, logically or otherwise. If you killed a person, you could move all the way to the other side of the world and you still wouldn't get rid of the guilt because it was your fault.

Although the Jester's haunt should just be repealed and replaced with Role blocking all Guilty voters. It's better that way since Jester choosing who to haunt is, like Pirate, random from a gameplay perspective.

Think you may be forgetting that it's actually the Jester's spectre that "haunts" the guilty voter. Whoever was transported elsewhere isn't home to be haunted. It makes sense that the guilt is thus avoided.

[Parallax7]

I still feel that if Jester is going to remain Neutral Evil, it should haunt one person when lynched, despite innocent, guilty, or abstaining. It cannot choose, and it is determined by Executioner's RNG. In the grand scheme of things that essentially makes it a Executioner, but eh. It'd be put on par with the other NEs.

[SypieDypie]

The whole point of a jester is to punish someone who fell for your trap. If a transporter can make jester kill an abstainer or an inno voter, it defeats the whole purpose of a jester. In my opinion, nothing should be able to stop a jester kill. After all, nothing can stop a vig from dying of guilt after shooting a townie (unless transporter can change that guilt too, but I would hope not). Now I can agree with transporter switching guilt between two guilty voters, but not between a guilty and an abstainer/inno'er.

Thoughts on this matter?

EXACTLY. If there are two or three guilty voters, trans has a 30% to 50% chance of killing anybody else they want.

[ninjadog101]

Transporting the guilt from a jester actually makes a lot of sense: The jester goes to someone's house to make the guy in that house suicide, The transporter can switch the person who is supposed to be in that house with someone else, resulting in the jester accidentically haunting the wrong person.

sorry, but /NoSupport

It logically makes sense. I agree. It should stay as is. If you are transed into guilt, perhaps you should have done more to stop the town from lynching the Jester.

/no support

Did you just Lore>Balance? WHY?

Anyways, evils shouldn't be punished because they assisted a neutral EVIL, which is (generally) an ally. Jester is generally against town, so town shouldn't have voted guilty on an enemy, then be rewarded just because trans is in the game.

[Emberguard]

By that logic Transporter shouldn't be "rewarding" town by transporting the mafias kill off town and onto a mafia member.

There's no "reward" in shifting the Jesters guilt with the transporter, they've simply outplayed their opponent. There's no reason a player shouldn't be able to use their resources to defeat an opponent when what their role is doing hasn't changed in any way.

[marlony1]

By that logic Transporter shouldn't be "rewarding" town by transporting the mafias kill off town and onto a mafia member.

There's no "reward" in shifting the Jesters guilt with the transporter, they've simply outplayed their opponent. There's no reason a player shouldn't be able to use their resources to defeat an opponent when what their role is doing hasn't changed in any way.

You fail to realize that mafia and jester guilt is completely different.

Jester guilt has no form of protection

Can't be helped by Doc/Bodyguard/Jailor.

It's a free kill.



Not only that, but it's a one time thing and can change a game entirely. This is bad for a mafia who has the majority and loses because "Jester + Transporter sucks!1!1!"

[Mathelete]

By that logic Transporter shouldn't be "rewarding" town by transporting the mafias kill off town and onto a mafia member.

There's no "reward" in shifting the Jesters guilt with the transporter, they've simply outplayed their opponent. There's no reason a player shouldn't be able to use their resources to defeat an opponent when what their role is doing hasn't changed in any way.

By your logic, trans should be able to transport vigilante guilt. After all, they're just using their resources to defeat an opponent, right?

[Ogeezalo]

Well, this is being added in for Patch 1.6, coming out on June 6th.

[chitownmvp01]

Well, this is being added in for Patch 1.6, coming out on June 6th.

Yeah this thread should be moved to Implemented Suggestions then.

[spelerthomas]

The whole point of a jester is to punish someone who fell for your trap. If a transporter can make jester kill an abstainer or an inno voter, it defeats the whole purpose of a jester. In my opinion, nothing should be able to stop a jester kill. After all, nothing can stop a vig from dying of guilt after shooting a townie (unless transporter can change that guilt too, but I would hope not). Now I can agree with transporter switching guilt between two guilty voters, but not between a guilty and an abstainer/inno'er.

Thoughts on this matter?

Your first point in this post is wrong. The whole point of a jester ISNT to punish someone who fell for your trap, the whole point of the jester is TO GET LYNCHED. Being able to choose the person who died is a cool benefit, but as a neutral you should just not care. Most jesters don't care anyway, mostly just asking the dead who he/she should target and doing that or not doing that. Therefore I LIKE the transporting mechanic in the game. It makes transporters just a little bit less useless.