Would this be a 100% full proof town strat?

[MadBaron]

Although it is virtually impossible to pull off, this is surely a full proof strategy to win as town:

D1 everyone reveals their role

D2 any cc claims (RT possibilities) are compiled and every one of them is hanged/executed by townies/jailor/vig.

Continue this D3.

Win by D4.


Obviously a boring strategy but it is a potentially huge flaw in the game. The only potential counter is WW games who could kill multiple people early game.

[Bodhrak]

It doesn't work because of simple math.

In ranked town has Jailor, 5 "Fixed" slots and 3 RT slots.
This means that there would be more CCs than you'd have possibilities to get rid of.

Example
You get the following claims
Jailor
6 claims for TI (1 RT, 2 Maf, 1 NE)
3 claims for TP (1 RT, 1 NK)
2 claims for TS (1 Maf)
3 claims for TK (1RT, 1 Maf)

Now who do you execute, shoot and lynch?

[spelerthomas]

In ranked there are 3 random towns, which means there are a lot of claims. Imagine a weird scenario where all the random towns are TI and all the evils claims TI including NE. Then you'd have 2 TI that are rolled TI, you have 3 RT that got rolled TI and you have 6 (4 maf + NK + NE) that claim TI. So you have 11 out of 15 TI claims. Try to win that in day 4.

But some more basic math. There are 3 Random towns so in that there are already 6 that share their role. Then there are 6 evils, so if there's only 1 tk but an evil claims tk, then there is a counterclaim so thats 2 added.

Basicly it means that if a person does not get a counterclaim it is a very good indication that that person is probably whatever he says he is.

[FrankLeeAwful]

Why reveal everyone when you can vote for roles and catch scummy behavior instead?

[kyuss420]

This is how most VIP games are played in coven mode, and people complain that the role list is unbalanced. Coven have 4 TP slots in which to hide, by day 3 maybe 1 or 2 townies havent claimed.... all non claimers are lynched or shot by vig, any disputes are settled by lynching 1 and shooting the other if the lynched guy was inno (or lynching the following day).

Yes it is a very powerful town strat, in ranked. Mafia would have to bus one of their weaker members for their ''sheriff'' claim to hold up. Ofc theres guys on thread pointing out a 1 in 20 scenario where it wouldnt work, but end of the day, a talking town always wins. Townies are gonna claim eventually, so may as well claim early while majority favors town, trying to settle role disputes when maf have 1 or 2 days to gain majority usually results in a town fail.

Also forcing evils to claim early, can screw them over later on, when they kill someone whos role proves they cant be what they claimed.

It doesn't work because of simple math.

In ranked town has Jailor, 5 "Fixed" slots and 3 RT slots.
This means that there would be more CCs than you'd have possibilities to get rid of.

Example
You get the following claims
Jailor
6 claims for TI (1 RT, 2 Maf, 1 NE)
3 claims for TP (1 RT, 1 NK)
2 claims for TS (1 Maf)
3 claims for TK (1RT, 1 Maf)

Now who do you execute, shoot and lynch?

So, we'll start with the TI day 2, surely one of the wills wont hold up or 2 maf will be trying to confirm each other. LO would of confirmed the TPs who were on the jailor, so NK, in this example, is boned, unless he wasted the night actually attacking the jailor, and possibly dieing to BG in the process.
day 3 - maf and NK have killed confirming 2 roles, (if NK wasnt lynched day 2) all of a sudden those claim slots just got a lot tighter. The real TIs will be posting their wills to confirm themselves, maf wont want to kill them, because then their TI claim wont hold up, TIs would most likely be checking each other because 6 TIs is most unlikely. Town and jailor can now scumread to spot the fake TIs by wrong wills, or poor wills (I didnt check the guy who cced me, i checked the TS claim)
day4 if you mislynched a TI the day before, then lynch another, obviously the TS hasnt RBed/Transed/revealed (unless consort, who will be sus anyway, if not called out by a spy) so can only claim retri or medium, if you mislynched day before, retri claim is screwed, If theres a medium then 2nd medium claim is screwed, so TS isnt really a good claim for maf to start with. Also another townie dead, so the role list thins out.

I could go on with hypotheticals to counter your hypotheticals all day but point being, your simple math changes every day, with every maf/NK kill and every lynch thinning out the claim space. Better to force role disputes when town has majority or its mafias advantage

[Bodhrak]

I could go on with hypotheticals to counter your hypotheticals all day but point being, your simple math changes every day, with every maf/NK kill and every lynch thinning out the claim space. Better to force role disputes when town has majority or its mafias advantage

That's not even the point. Early on town will have no clue who to target, later on there will be disputes and holes in wills.

On the other hand while information is powerful for town it also is for mafia.
It essentially gives maf a free consig on everyone.
It means they exactly know who to target with their kills - Spy claims, TP claims, then Jailor and so on.
It also means precise forges can be made. Disguises can fool town.
It means maf will know when there's no Spy, LO from the start and they can target accordingly.

The TP/LO on Jailor meta might even be negative in this environment - by the time they are confirmed, those roles can already be dead. Or the "remaining" TP might be an Arso.
So it would be better for TP/LO to go on each other.

Maf would have to take a few risks here and play more boldly, but sure the mayority (> 2/3s) of games are lost anyway.

[Kombinator1991]

Not enough time for that, but could work. This is the most extreme VFR style. Technically you vfr everyone's role on start.

[fable979]

If NE is witch, town is fucked.

[kyuss420]

If NE is witch, town is fucked.

Except in coven, where theres always a Coven Leader (witch with killing abilities), when everyone has claimed by day 3 town always wins. People act like Maf can kill more than 1 person a night

[MsDarkMagician]

No, that just sounds like common sense.

[Kombinator1991]

In my experience town with tons of vfr. is easy town win. 9 from 10 times when town gets roles quickly the town wins.
1. Disputes come out soon.
2. Evils get screwed by killing roles, that hides them.
3. Evils often forget to inno, or worse go for guilty. Very common mistake.
4. Just because an important role is revealed early it means nothing. TP, LO, RTs are there to protect, or watch you. Even with revealed jailor townies might talk to each other and decide to scatter the defenses a little. For example doc. reveals, and jailor is known. In this case RT TP, or lookout will be on doc., and doc. protects jailor.
5. Even with no dead chance of getting evil by vfr is 40%. And even if you get town there is a good chance, that it won't harm revealing their role, and getting evil to force claim will be benefitial later.

[BasicFourLife]

congrats, youre one of the first people in this forum who ive seen suggesting this strategy

everyone against it is retarded and shouldnt play Ranked

everyone in the comments who is against it because of RTs is dumb, its much better to have everyone's roles known than to just lynch people. also the mafia cant change their claims anymore, escorts cannot fuck up on rbing conf townies, tis will only target potential Evil candidates, vig will shoot conf evils and vet will just save all of their alerts or randomlt use them since no Town has the need of visiting a Vet claim while the Mafia needs to get rid of him sooner or later anyways, etc etc

the benefits are enormous compared to the negatives, also not to mention the fact of how 2 tos strongest MAfia roles (although consig is not that strong, but in tos he is because the community is brain dead) are completely useless, Janitor can only erase wills now and Consig can only be used to find NEs

[lalasex]

i feel like everyone just dont wanna give evils ANY chance to win (by that i dont mean they should be steamrolled)


most of the times evils can lose BY simply being screwed for lucky town rolelist or just 1-2 VERY unlucky consequences

also those meta DOESNT include people using their brain/intuition/logic and etc...this is so mechanic,bland and boring asf, NOT the way this game should be played, soulless asf.....ALSO when evils really playing it well they still lose for unknown reasons LOL

anytime this meta doesnt depend on player's skill and this is the reason why community is pretty much doomed

your "new metas" makes game only worse and everyone starting to lose IQ for reals

[TheDebil]

Why reveal everyone when you can vote for roles and catch scummy behavior instead?

+++

people dont understand how easy it is to actually catch scum in tos. 9/10 times that one inactive guy with no claim, who has not voted scum, he will be scum too
we dont need these strategies to win, this actually makes it harder

[TheDebil]

congrats, youre one of the first people in this forum who ive seen suggesting this strategy

everyone against it is retarded and shouldnt play Ranked

everyone in the comments who is against it because of RTs is dumb, its much better to have everyone's roles known than to just lynch people. also the mafia cant change their claims anymore, escorts cannot fuck up on rbing conf townies, tis will only target potential Evil candidates, vig will shoot conf evils and vet will just save all of their alerts or randomlt use them since no Town has the need of visiting a Vet claim while the Mafia needs to get rid of him sooner or later anyways, etc etc

the benefits are enormous compared to the negatives, also not to mention the fact of how 2 tos strongest MAfia roles (although consig is not that strong, but in tos he is because the community is brain dead) are completely useless, Janitor can only erase wills now and Consig can only be used to find NEs

just learn how to play properly dude
if this shit actually came to be it would ruin the game completely

[BasicFourLife]

congrats, youre one of the first people in this forum who ive seen suggesting this strategy

everyone against it is retarded and shouldnt play Ranked

everyone in the comments who is against it because of RTs is dumb, its much better to have everyone's roles known than to just lynch people. also the mafia cant change their claims anymore, escorts cannot fuck up on rbing conf townies, tis will only target potential Evil candidates, vig will shoot conf evils and vet will just save all of their alerts or randomlt use them since no Town has the need of visiting a Vet claim while the Mafia needs to get rid of him sooner or later anyways, etc etc

the benefits are enormous compared to the negatives, also not to mention the fact of how 2 tos strongest MAfia roles (although consig is not that strong, but in tos he is because the community is brain dead) are completely useless, Janitor can only erase wills now and Consig can only be used to find NEs

just learn how to play properly dude
if this shit actually came to be it would ruin the game completely

this could easily be fixed, but the reason why this meta doesnt exist yet is because tos community is too small and ranked is too unimportant that no one cares

[Flavorable]

congrats, youre one of the first people in this forum who ive seen suggesting this strategy

everyone against it is retarded and shouldnt play Ranked

everyone in the comments who is against it because of RTs is dumb, its much better to have everyone's roles known than to just lynch people. also the mafia cant change their claims anymore, escorts cannot fuck up on rbing conf townies, tis will only target potential Evil candidates, vig will shoot conf evils and vet will just save all of their alerts or randomlt use them since no Town has the need of visiting a Vet claim while the Mafia needs to get rid of him sooner or later anyways, etc etc

the benefits are enormous compared to the negatives, also not to mention the fact of how 2 tos strongest MAfia roles (although consig is not that strong, but in tos he is because the community is brain dead) are completely useless, Janitor can only erase wills now and Consig can only be used to find NEs

Please don't necro-bump threads that have had no reply in 1 month.