Jailor Meta and TPLO

Discuss the newest strategies involving the game in a professional manner and spread your knowledge

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby cob709 » Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:40 pm

There are many more ways to gain leads other than VFR and TIs.
Some might include using chat logs, asking questions, and looking at votes.
Town can work together to make progress towards finding evils without TIs.
I SEE ALL
User avatar
cob709
Mayor
Mayor
 
Posts: 852
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:44 am

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Joacgroso » Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:11 pm

Again, you can't look at votes if there are no votes. Same goes for chat logs. By the time there is enough information to do something, evils already have mayority. Remember it's usually LyLo by day 2. And what kind of questions would you ask besides "role?" or "will?" or "any ccs?"?
Joacgroso wrote:I feel like I went from Light Yagami to Keiichi Maebara.

I still hope one day the game will have private lobbies. They would really help.
Also, please nerf vampire hunters.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Werewolf
Werewolf
 
Posts: 3738
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby cob709 » Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:43 pm

I can't tell you how to play the game. The best I can do is give you tips.
One of the best ways of learning is to play a bunch of games and see what works.

Problem solving is an important skill to have. Every single action cannot be calculated, so knowing how to analyze behavior and adapt to different situations is important.
I SEE ALL
User avatar
cob709
Mayor
Mayor
 
Posts: 852
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:44 am

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby OreCreeper » Tue Dec 29, 2020 12:04 pm

Joacgroso wrote:Again, you can't look at votes if there are no votes. Same goes for chat logs. By the time there is enough information to do something, evils already have mayority. Remember it's usually LyLo by day 2. And what kind of questions would you ask besides "role?" or "will?" or "any ccs?"?

Because it's LyLo by d2, it is necessary for town to be able to figure out how to weed out the weak claimers and non-claimers as soon as possible, and forces town to learn to rely on scumreading instead of being passive.
OreCreeper
Vigilante
Vigilante
 
Posts: 626
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:52 pm

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Emily372 » Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:29 pm

I don't believe in jailor meta.
Serial Killer has killed the TT Jailor... and now the Town has congratulated that serial killer for no reason.
That TT Jailor has a will covered in blood, making it unreadable...
Since there is no medium, the town lost to the SK.
User avatar
Emily372
Witch
Witch
 
Posts: 55
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2020 6:32 pm
Location: Trapped in the tower.

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby dolphina » Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:48 pm

Emily372 wrote:I don't believe in jailor meta.

that is one hell of a necrobump my dude
Hi. I'm Kokichi Ouma, and you're watching Disney Channel.

the forums are dead and i’m never coming back. maybe i’ll play this game again sometime


He/him pronouns. Trans rights! Also, some people call me Kokichi, Koki, or Kok. You can use those names, too.


My Discord server
PM me for my Discord!
I’m a self proclaimed anarchist, and a god of chaos (apparently).
My stinky FM Record
User avatar
dolphina
Blackmailer
Blackmailer
 
Posts: 1163
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2020 1:33 pm
Location: Lighting fires in Fairview

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby XHybridX » Fri Apr 16, 2021 7:18 am

The thing that makes jailor meta dumb is that if the jailor isn't good or is getting too many whispers it really messes up the town. Everyone is too dependent on one townie.
█▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀▀█
█░░╦─╦╔╗╦─╔╗╔╗╔╦╗╔╗░░█
█░░║║║╠─║─║─║║║║║╠─░░█
█░░╚╩╝╚╝╚╝╚╝╚╝╩─╩╚╝░░█
█▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄█
XHybridX
Amnesiac
Amnesiac
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:34 pm

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby syjfwbaobfwl » Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:34 am

yep, and anyway its a super lazy and unhealthy strat
syjfwbaobfwl
Vigilante
Vigilante
 
Posts: 662
Joined: Thu May 07, 2020 1:50 pm

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Cookazoo2 » Mon May 10, 2021 11:18 am

i'm trying to write an evolution of this strategy that involves the current list.

in effect, the goal is to aggressively out as many confirmable townies and the TS slot as quickly as possible and then force an executioner to claim to get their target lynched day 2.

from there, force TK to claim vigilante day three and then every night from then on nail a scum player. on day three, with the combination of a jailor execution, vigi shot/vet confirmation, and a lynch, you should be able to nail at least one scum from that.

the ultimate goal is to then only have to kill the mafia and an executioner, endgaming the witch.

overall, jailor just leads a town blitzkrieg, preventing mafia from being able to claim early.
Hiya. I'm a Tactical Mafia Kills supporter.

Help balance the Aliens!
User avatar
Cookazoo2
Doctor
Doctor
 
Posts: 195
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:41 pm
Location: Salem, Massachusetts, at a murder mystery party

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby OreCreeper » Mon May 10, 2021 10:18 pm

Cookazoo2 wrote:i'm trying to write an evolution of this strategy that involves the current list.

in effect, the goal is to aggressively out as many confirmable townies and the TS slot as quickly as possible and then force an executioner to claim to get their target lynched day 2.

from there, force TK to claim vigilante day three and then every night from then on nail a scum player. on day three, with the combination of a jailor execution, vigi shot/vet confirmation, and a lynch, you should be able to nail at least one scum from that.

the ultimate goal is to then only have to kill the mafia and an executioner, endgaming the witch.

overall, jailor just leads a town blitzkrieg, preventing mafia from being able to claim early.

This wouldn't really work, especially if the jailor metas. It gives RMs a free pass to go on jailor and "confirm" themselves as TP. Town wouldn't (and shouldn't) take the risk of hunting RM because one mislynch early game and it's game over with meta jailor. The other evils should claim TI/TS/TK D2 and if possible, win a 1-for-1 (vets, transes, escs are good targets). Then witch controls jailor, making it 6v6 D3. It's just way too easy to go wrong with jailor meta in the current rolelist.
OreCreeper
Vigilante
Vigilante
 
Posts: 626
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:52 pm

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby MrIncendiary88 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 1:09 am

Just wanted to revive this thread. Ye i also stopped playing because of Jailor Meta. Anyway Jailor Meta is forced because not revealing means a) no town co-ordination N1 and b) you are taking the risk of being randomly killed by the Mafia N1 and when that happens its pretty much a normal game cuz there is no more Jailor.

I wonder if replacing the Jailor with a fixed Vigilante in the old Ranked setup with NE and NK would’ve made the difference? There would be no Vigi meta because of the fixed Witch chance and there can be multiple of them, so Vigi is claimable and GF / SK / Witch would have an edge with their basic night immunity. Also if there is Mayor in game they can’t be Jailed as no Jailor in game. Would this be too huge of a buff for evils though would be my worry but I think it should be all fine.
Good day.
My Name is Gerald, although I would much prefer to be called Sir.

About MrIncendiary88:

Spoiler: Name: Gerald Felneus
Age: Speculated to be around their early 30s
Role: Arsonist+Forger
Last Seen: Counterclaiming a Vigilante
ELO: ~1530 (GOLD, AND CLIMBING)


Spoiler:
Image
User avatar
MrIncendiary88
Witch
Witch
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 9:54 am
Location: someones garden

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Soulshade55r » Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:52 pm

MrIncendiary88 wrote:Just wanted to revive this thread. Ye i also stopped playing because of Jailor Meta. Anyway Jailor Meta is forced because not revealing means a) no town co-ordination N1 and b) you are taking the risk of being randomly killed by the Mafia N1 and when that happens its pretty much a normal game cuz there is no more Jailor.

I wonder if replacing the Jailor with a fixed Vigilante in the old Ranked setup with NE and NK would’ve made the difference? There would be no Vigi meta because of the fixed Witch chance and there can be multiple of them, so Vigi is claimable and GF / SK / Witch would have an edge with their basic night immunity. Also if there is Mayor in game they can’t be Jailed as no Jailor in game. Would this be too huge of a buff for evils though would be my worry but I think it should be all fine.


The old setup was bad for serval reasons, NK is bassically neutral benign with a kill everynight which people have pretended is balanced for years, but in general the NK has always been a unbalanced chaotic figure, I'm not totally aganist a ranked with it but I wouldn't call it a "balanced" ranked and I'd believe roles like survivor/Amne would even be more balanced.

Jailor is a problem, personally I believe a 5v10 meta is a good meta if you
1: don't have power roles or heavily nerf them power roles Jailor comes to mind also Mayor and transporter.
2: mafia gets tatical kills or buffed in any major way
3: more NEs with witches wincon only, jester/exe moved to another slot, allows more varity in NE without having a chaotic either extra team member or slightly evil sided nb (like jester)
4: remove easy confirm metas and focus on roles having to actually play well to be confirmed

Some other things might also be required.

In general the current meta is really bad because it's about town confirming players really quickly, I feel like mafia have limited room to make any plays yes they might easily win early and its balanced stay wise but its normally because town couldn't confirm that many and end up killing the wrong players. Worst part is some games are over day 3/4 when ideally games should last quite a bit longer Imo
Favourite Roles (To play)
Spoiler: Town: Jailor
Mafia: Consort
NE: Witch
NB: Guardian Angel
Coven: Necromancer
NC: Pirate
User avatar
Soulshade55r
Blackmailer
Blackmailer
 
Posts: 1107
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:45 pm
Location: Uk

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby MrIncendiary88 » Sun Oct 03, 2021 8:17 am

Soulshade55r wrote:
MrIncendiary88 wrote:Just wanted to revive this thread. Ye i also stopped playing because of Jailor Meta. Anyway Jailor Meta is forced because not revealing means a) no town co-ordination N1 and b) you are taking the risk of being randomly killed by the Mafia N1 and when that happens its pretty much a normal game cuz there is no more Jailor.

I wonder if replacing the Jailor with a fixed Vigilante in the old Ranked setup with NE and NK would’ve made the difference? There would be no Vigi meta because of the fixed Witch chance and there can be multiple of them, so Vigi is claimable and GF / SK / Witch would have an edge with their basic night immunity. Also if there is Mayor in game they can’t be Jailed as no Jailor in game. Would this be too huge of a buff for evils though would be my worry but I think it should be all fine.


The old setup was bad for serval reasons, NK is bassically neutral benign with a kill everynight which people have pretended is balanced for years, but in general the NK has always been a unbalanced chaotic figure, I'm not totally aganist a ranked with it but I wouldn't call it a "balanced" ranked and I'd believe roles like survivor/Amne would even be more balanced.

Jailor is a problem, personally I believe a 5v10 meta is a good meta if you
1: don't have power roles or heavily nerf them power roles Jailor comes to mind also Mayor and transporter.
2: mafia gets tatical kills or buffed in any major way
3: more NEs with witches wincon only, jester/exe moved to another slot, allows more varity in NE without having a chaotic either extra team member or slightly evil sided nb (like jester)
4: remove easy confirm metas and focus on roles having to actually play well to be confirmed

Some other things might also be required.

In general the current meta is really bad because it's about town confirming players really quickly, I feel like mafia have limited room to make any plays yes they might easily win early and its balanced stay wise but its normally because town couldn't confirm that many and end up killing the wrong players. Worst part is some games are over day 3/4 when ideally games should last quite a bit longer Imo



I disagree with saying NK being an unbalanced chaotic figure. I do agree that it is like a NB but it can be very independant in reaching its Win Con. The job of NK was to keep the teams balanced and survive for as long as possible until eventually one of the teams have to rely on teaming with NK in hopes that they screw up.

Ideally NK should help Mafia at the start because Town is in the majority, NK just randomly killing people including Mafia will end up biting them back, they have to keep the Mafia alive to take their placeholder in being lynched and also any scapegoats that the NK can use. This playstyle that the ideal NK should have makes the setup balanced, it gives Mafia a temporary ally to provide them with extra kills in the earlygame.

Now the old setup wasn’t good because of Jailor. NK was ok to play if Jailor died on N1 for example. People leaved as NK because it was too hard, they couldn’t cope with Jailor, hence that screwed the Mafia over big time as they couldn’t make up the lack of kills and scapegoats they had.

Easy confirm meta can be fine when the NK can make use to kill people that are already confirmed. The Mafia are the evil team with the most info, Mafia wil kill the more obscure higher priority targets while NK gets rid of the confirmed thorns in the back. And btw Mafia have seen their buffs and a good Mafia team can be really deadly, buffing Mafia is not the solution in question here. The priority is dealing with the Power roles like Jailor and excluding them I think is the best solution.
Good day.
My Name is Gerald, although I would much prefer to be called Sir.

About MrIncendiary88:

Spoiler: Name: Gerald Felneus
Age: Speculated to be around their early 30s
Role: Arsonist+Forger
Last Seen: Counterclaiming a Vigilante
ELO: ~1530 (GOLD, AND CLIMBING)


Spoiler:
Image
User avatar
MrIncendiary88
Witch
Witch
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 9:54 am
Location: someones garden

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby PatrykSzczescie » Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:31 am

With low ELO players, jailor meta is quite strong. Townies follow the lead of jailor claim and make appropriate visits. RMs and witch are afraid of visiting the jailor because they don't want to be exposed by LO. LO games start with many clears. Without LO, evils are not sure whether LO is in the game so they play with an assumption there's one. Evils with TP/LO/esc/spy claim are usually hanged for admitting not to visit the jailor.

With high ELO players, jailor meta is balanced and you can win the game by outing as jailor as well as without outing as jailor. With jailor meta, you usually have RM visit the jailor. It's optimal to soft-clear visitors and focus on VFR those who didn't visit the jailor for both mafia killing and witch that are powerful evils. If you manage to kill one mafia killing and jail the other, town most likely wins the game by keeping the mafia killing and witch/consort have no power except for forcing execution. When town loses majority, jailor will most likely be witched or roleblocked by a consort but it's possible to regain majority because of transporter, mayor and TK. Also, LO can inform the jailor about evil visitors preventing executions so jailor can execute the witch next (if there's no consort) then regain ability to execute other evils.

Whether jailor meta is better or not depends on the rolelist. Some rolelists are powerful with jailor meta, other ones (especially when there's a consort and no trans) make silent jailor a better option but you never know which rolelist you have.
PatrykSzczescie
Transporter
Transporter
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:21 am

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Aubrieta » Tue May 31, 2022 5:36 pm

Jailor meta is the easiest way to win as town, but it should be made useless by disallowing talking day 1. Makes the game more balanced for evils.
Aubrieta
Executioner
Executioner
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:43 pm

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby Joacgroso » Tue May 31, 2022 6:20 pm

I think the game is already random enough, disallowing day 1 talks would only make it worse. Besides, jailor meta would just move to day 2. Getting a lucky shot on the jailor night 1 isn't that satisfying, anyway.
Joacgroso wrote:I feel like I went from Light Yagami to Keiichi Maebara.

I still hope one day the game will have private lobbies. They would really help.
Also, please nerf vampire hunters.
User avatar
Joacgroso
Werewolf
Werewolf
 
Posts: 3738
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 6:21 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: Jailor Meta and TPLO

Postby tonicpower » Thu Jun 30, 2022 8:07 am

also you could claim who you are going to jail in case of sk, at least in CAA. In ranked I see it as giving a chance for mafia to frame vigis/vets by not attacking, but even then it's a 50/50 whether you (MK) or a TK gets jailed
tonicpower
Amnesiac
Amnesiac
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2014 5:30 am

Previous

Return to Strategic Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests