Spy (Rework)

[GuardianOverkill]

Not everyone’s first language is English. Mocking someone’s speaking style is biased, arrogant, ignorant, and incompetent.

I wasn't mocking his English you jackass. You are the biased, arrogant, ignorant, incompetent one for even suggesting such a thing. I was pointing out that he is a complete idiot who does not understand the points people make despite how clear they are, BUT he pretends that he is able to. He is the worst type of person to have a conversation with because instead of actually making points all he does is pretend to not know what is being said to him.

[Soulshade55r]

Not everyone’s first language is English. Mocking someone’s speaking style is biased, arrogant, ignorant, and incompetent.

I wasn't mocking his English you jackass. You are the biased, arrogant, ignorant, incompetent one for even suggesting such a thing. I was pointing out that he is a complete idiot who does not understand the points people make despite how clear they are, BUT he pretends that he is able to. He is the worst type of person to have a conversation with because instead of actually making points all he does is pretend to not know what is being said to him.

Someones very toxic.

Your point was bugging isn't useless but It's VERY useless I have not once seen bugging do anything Important.

Get off your high-horse

[GuardianOverkill]

Yeah, you are toxic, thanks for admitting it. If any one is on a high horse it is you. Take a good look at yourself.

Just because you haven't seen it, does not make it something that isn't happening.

You made this what it is.

[oliy]

Stop with the personal insults and focus on the role given, you're just derailing the thread. Take the issue to DMs if you feel it's necessary.

[GuardianOverkill]

1. Your first post in a thread should not be telling us what to do.
2. We are also talking about the role idea.

If you dislike our method of conversation, please lock the thread or leave us be.

[Boredfan1]

I'd remove Spy, thank you very much.

Why

Because the Spy is overpowered. This version of the Spy is overpowered as well. Did they visit an "Outsider", Mafia, or Coven? Ask who they visited. It's powerful with a Lookout as well because the Spy knows what visited while the Lookout knows who.

The current spy is NOT overpowered, it's been severely weakened. It can't read the mafia chat, it can't read whispers and it can't see visits while dead. ALL these things use to be a thing however. The ONLY change it needs is for it to not to be able to see all mafia visits, such as the godfather and the support roles.

[BasicFourLife]

The current spy is NOT overpowered, it's been severely weakened. It can't read the mafia chat, it can't read whispers and it can't see visits while dead. ALL these things use to be a thing however. The ONLY change it needs is for it to not to be able to see all mafia visits, such as the godfather and the support roles.

And obviously none of those nerfs addressed all of the issues with Spy. Also, just because it's been nerfed doesn't mean it can't be overpowered (I'm not saying that it is overpowered). Whether they were "severe nerfs" or not is up for debate, and I would disagree; I would say that the most powerful traits of Spy still exist.

The issue with Spy is NOT that it's overpowered. The issue with Spy is that it has inherent issues which are game breaking, which of course is influenced by powerful traits, but they are two separate things.

Example: Spy depends heavily on what Mafia roles roll to make it useful. It's useless in double Janitor games with no Escorts. Or overpowered in Disguiser/Framer/Forger games with Escorts.

[Boredfan1]

Regardless of what roles the mafia roll, the spy can still potentially find immunes because someone didn't die to the mafia. If it can see godfather visits, then it knows if there's a godfather or not at least some of the time. Again, it wouldn't be overpowered if some roles it can't see visit. Ambusher, godfather and mafioso should be seen.

[Soulshade55r]

Spy shouldn't be spoon fed infomation I hate roles like that (PSYCHICCHCICHCI)

Also if you look at it I gave it a big nerf.