Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

Implement my Jester?

Yes!
23
38%
Yes, but as a new role!
17
28%
No!
21
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Total votes : 61

Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:35 am

Blackwolfe99 wrote:By that same logic,the Witch is an issue too since they can control a killer or vampire to kill other evils and on more than one occasion.

Yeah, a bad Witch controls killers or Vampires more than once. A good Jester or a bad Jester, either one can easily kill evils. A good Witch isn't controlling killers or really any evil unless they want that evil to lose. So no, it's not the same.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Blackwolfe99 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:39 am

HereThereEverywhere wrote:
Blackwolfe99 wrote:By that same logic,the Witch is an issue too since they can control a killer or vampire to kill other evils and on more than one occasion.

Yeah, a bad Witch controls killers or Vampires more than once. A good Jester or a bad Jester, either one can easily kill evils. A good Witch isn't controlling killers or really any evil unless they want that evil to lose. So no, it's not the same.

You're right, but that's also dependent on the evils voting guilty on the jester, so it's not really jester's fault if they kill an evil. The evils should be the most cautious of who they lynch unless they're sure that the person isn't jester or is exe target.
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EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW

/support
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:42 am

The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Blackwolfe99 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:46 am

HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

True as well, but someone acting too obviously scummy should be erred on the side of caution when being lynched.
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/support
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby RHCube » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:47 am

HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

It's also easy to tell if someone is a jester. If someone is acting like a jester, then you should just wait for someone to kill them instead of lynching them. Or just ignore them
Last edited by RHCube on Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Blackwolfe99 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:48 am

RHCube wrote:
HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

It's also easy to tell if someone is a jester. If someone is acting like a jester, then you should just wait for the vig/jailor to kill them instead of lynching them.

Not necessarily, I tend to remain quiet as jester so people think I'm evil. It works most of the time.
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/support
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:48 am

That's why I didn't say "too obviously scummy" because we're talking about good Jesters hurting scum, not bad Jesters failing to get lynched.
RHCube wrote:
HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

It's also easy to tell if someone is a jester. If someone is acting like a jester, then you should just wait for someone to kill them instead of lynching them. Or just ignore them

This is assuming all Jesters act like a Jester. Some don't. So you're either saying never lynch ANY scum because Jesters act like scum, or you're saying every last Jester acts like a Jester.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby RHCube » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:57 am

Blackwolfe99 wrote:
RHCube wrote:
HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

It's also easy to tell if someone is a jester. If someone is acting like a jester, then you should just wait for the vig/jailor to kill them instead of lynching them.

Not necessarily, I tend to remain quiet as jester so people think I'm evil. It works most of the time.

That's why you should also suspect quiet players of being a jester. it's best to just wait for them to die at night.

HereThereEverywhere wrote:That's why I didn't say "too obviously scummy" because we're talking about good Jesters hurting scum, not bad Jesters failing to get lynched.
RHCube wrote:
HereThereEverywhere wrote:The problem is that it's too easy to lynch a Jester. Someone acting scummy and it's obvious they're going to be lynched? Evils aren't going to abstain in case they get called evil as well. It's not their fault it just happens to be a Jester.

It's also easy to tell if someone is a jester. If someone is acting like a jester, then you should just wait for someone to kill them instead of lynching them. Or just ignore them

This is assuming all Jesters act like a Jester. Some don't. So you're either saying never lynch ANY scum because Jesters act like scum, or you're saying every last Jester acts like a Jester.

I'm not saying that. I'm just saying you should suspect scum of being a jester.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:14 am

That's another problem, it means Town should be afraid to lynch scum - what else would suspecting all scum of being a potential Jester mean?
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby BPsycho2 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:08 pm

if you suspect all scum to be a potential jester, then either the scum is bad at the game, or you are. Not much to do with the rework


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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Soulshade55r » Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:08 pm

The current jester is good.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby BPsycho2 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 5:25 pm

Why do you think so?
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:56 pm

Soulshade55r wrote:The current jester is good.


You do realize the current alignment for Jester is in appropriate given it's impact, correct?
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby JGaming08 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:59 pm

JGaming08 wrote:
Parallax7 wrote:-You own four pranks to last you through the game.

Seems like too many, guarantee's the Jester a win. I'd say you nerf it to three.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:01 pm

JGaming08 wrote:
JGaming08 wrote:
Parallax7 wrote:-You own four pranks to last you through the game.

Seems like too many, guarantee's the Jester a win. I'd say you nerf it to three.


It is 3.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby JGaming08 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:05 pm

Parallax7 wrote:
JGaming08 wrote:
JGaming08 wrote:
Parallax7 wrote:-You own four pranks to last you through the game.

Seems like too many, guarantee's the Jester a win. I'd say you nerf it to three.


It is 3.

Oh, did you nerf it? Sorry I didn't see.

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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:07 pm

Smash that support vote, and throw this thing into your sig;)
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Random777 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:41 pm

I like the role a lot! I think it has a lot of potential and really makes the role something that can be a nuisance to both the town and evil roles. My only issue is, and I know this is more my own thing, I'm just not a fan of roles really getting revamped, unless I feel they ABSOLUTELY need to be fixed, such as the case with spy at the current moment. In my opinion, I'm really neutral on it, because I would be fine if it stayed the same but I also would be fine if the role got revamped to something like this. Overall, brilliant concept for a role that does not get enough love, but I'm just not sure if I'm ready to say goodbye to the current jester.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:58 pm

On page two I mentioned something about keeping the original Jester as a Chaos role, would that work for people?
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:01 pm

HereThereEverywhere wrote:On page two I mentioned something about keeping the original Jester as a Chaos role, would that work for people?


This could be used in competitive play if they ever decided to bring Neutral Benign to Ranked.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:06 pm

...How does that relate to keeping the original Jester as an NC? I'm not saying your idea doesn't work, I just mean for those people who want to keep the original Jester as well.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:08 pm

HereThereEverywhere wrote:...How does that relate to keeping the original Jester as an NC? I'm not saying your idea doesn't work, I just mean for those people who want to keep the original Jester as well.


It was sort of a, people like how Jester affects Ranked play; something I thought I'd throw out in the open. No particular goal in mind. Promotes discussion, no?
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby HereThereEverywhere » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:12 pm

I'm still confused.
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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Parallax7 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:16 pm

HereThereEverywhere wrote:I'm still confused.


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Re: Jester Overhaul #SeeNoNeutralEvil

Postby Jackparrot » Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:43 am

Maybe make jester and execountioner a NB, because it has it's own win conditions?
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