Cult (Informed Minority)

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

What do you think?

To the Testing Grounds
61
53%
Needs just a bit of work
19
17%
Unbalanced (Comment)
2
2%
Idea will never work (Comment)
8
7%
To The Testing Grounds
25
22%
 
Total votes : 115

Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:05 pm

BuckeyeNation wrote:Way too OP. You just target people that claim their role.

Exactly, so then you cant just spy test then lead the town. That and then people cant confirm themselves, like "Ok im vigilante im shooting Gooose26 tonight."

Then you stop him from doing his job...

Or you can claim that you didnt do a specific job or something as an evil for more time or something...
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:45 pm

So occasional multi-night roleblock...

Does the Rbed person get a message they were blocked? Is it different from regular RB message?

Otherwise seems straightforward. Maybe call it a Hypnotist or something
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:49 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:So occasional multi-night roleblock...

Does the Rbed person get a message they were blocked? Is it different from regular RB message?

Otherwise seems straightforward. Maybe call it a Hypnotist or something

Well that goes to another idea that i had. Maybe it would be unknown, but you can still try to use your ability. If they do, then they will lose a charge and it wont work, but they wont know it
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 4:34 pm

This seems good now. Maybe give the person a notification after the hypnosis (roleblock) has expired, so they understand why their last two nights did nothing, but only after the fact.

Also, how would this affect sheriffs and invests and stuff? cos they get results immediately...
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 4:51 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:This seems good now. Maybe give the person a notification after the hypnosis (roleblock) has expired, so they understand why their last two nights did nothing, but only after the fact.

Also, how would this affect sheriffs and invests and stuff? cos they get results immediately...

Well i guess if they get results just nothing happens, so basically a roleblock. They dont have charges so it isnt that bad, but the lookout will just think nobody was visited
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:01 pm

Seems good. Tricks people with limited charges, regular RBs people without them. Maybe have in only be able to do this stuff every second night to compensate for having two nights of RB... or is that too similar to normal consort?
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:06 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:Seems good. Tricks people with limited charges, regular RBs people without them. Maybe have in only be able to do this stuff every second night to compensate for having two nights of RB... or is that too similar to normal consort?

Im just afraid that if this doesn't have a limited amount, then it will be op
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 7:06 pm

Right. Limited amount. Forgot. Limited amount is better, you're right.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:14 am

Alright so do we agree on the mechanics? 3 uses, 2 guess, lasts 2 nights. Will roleblock players but they wont be informed about it until after it ends. I still dont have a good name
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 4:22 pm

Idk. I came up with Hypnotist in one of the posts somewhere above... but idk how much that really suits it.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:09 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:Idk. I came up with Hypnotist in one of the posts somewhere above... but idk how much that really suits it.

Yea it is kinda weird. This guy is like a modern day example of the socratic method. Basically just guessing and stuff for the roles, but i dont know what you would call it
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:54 pm

Well someone who uses the Socratic method is a Sophist. Already have one of those.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby AlaskasJade » Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:22 pm

Seems very well made imo.
204 hours on steam version alone. (Played on browser version for a few years.)

1362 matches played total.

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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:57 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:Well someone who uses the Socratic method is a Sophist. Already have one of those.

Oh really? Well that'/s kind've frustrating. What if I changed the current Sophist back to the Scholar, and then made this knew one the Sophist?

AlaskasJade wrote:Seems very well made imo.

Thank you, took a lot of feedback and work to get to this point. Have any doubts or opinions on anything specific?
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:01 pm

Whatever you want with the name. Scholar and Sophist could work. Sophist and ... could work. Anything really.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:32 pm

Alright the previous Sophist was changed to the Prevaricator(Could be better, basically is just "Liar"), and the new Sophist was created. Also changed the Devout to the Cleric, as I like the name a lot better

I have another one, supposed to be like the disguiser how it is deceptive, but it really isn't close at all. It kind've has a lot of similar aspects to the Taxidermist, but here it is:

(ROLE NAME) (Cult Deception)
Abilities:
- May visit 1 player each night, and if that target is killed then the target will appear to be alive
- Any attacker that kills the player will get the "Your target was immune!"
- The target will only look alive for the next day, but may be visited again to look alive again

Attributes:
- Only 3 charges
- Sheriff and Investigator will find out that the player is in fact dead, but the lookout will only see who visited.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 9:12 pm

Seems good. You can't call it the Taxidermist I suppose. Maybe the... Puppeteer or the Voodoo Priest

And then, instead of Role or Sus/Not Sus, Invest and Sheriff both get:

Your target is a dead body held together with dark magic. They must be a Puppet/Zombie (depending on name of role)
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:07 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:Seems good. You can't call it the Taxidermist I suppose. Maybe the... Puppeteer or the Voodoo Priest

And then, instead of Role or Sus/Not Sus, Invest and Sheriff both get:

Your target is a dead body held together with dark magic. They must be a Puppet/Zombie (depending on name of role)

Exactly, that's what i meant in the attributes lol. And i like puppeteer. One thing i was scared about is if it would be too weak with only 3 charges. I was thinking maybe 4, 2/3rds an average game
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Salamandos35 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 1:36 am

4 charges seems good. And the player whose corpse was puppeted... should he be informed? because it means he can tell the medium, but otherwise will result in heaps of confusion and bug reports...

Also, can the Puppeteer speak through the Puppet or no? because that makes a massive impact on how powerful the ability is.
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 2:48 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:4 charges seems good. And the player whose corpse was puppeted... should he be informed? because it means he can tell the medium, but otherwise will result in heaps of confusion and bug reports...

Also, can the Puppeteer speak through the Puppet or no? because that makes a massive impact on how powerful the ability is.

No he cant, he is dead. He may look at the names pn the right and see his, or he may see that he is still in the circle of players and not pronounced dead, but he will be dead. But no talking or anything, the puppet is just looking like an inactive living player. Or course he can talk in the dead chat, and he will affect the overall voting count, so this role could destroy in late game feom that one vote
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:04 pm

Alright I added the Mortician(The last role i suggested), and i also gave information on the Cutthroat, even though it is really just the mafioso. I will be adding lore piece by piece day by day but i dont have it yet

I'm getting no feedback whatsoever :crying: But how about this new role?
(ROLE NAME) Cult Support
Abilities:
- Every night may choose to go on *alert*(Will find a better word :lol: )
- When on alert, anybody who visits a cultist will be shown by what role they are

Attributes:
- If somebody had visited a cultist at all before, the roles will be shown AND the name of the player, but seperately
- Only 3 charges

Good concept? Bad concept? Too underpowered? Too overpowered? I'm not done with this faction yet
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Re: Cult (Mafia Faction)

Postby Gooose26 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 9:30 pm

Another new role, will replace he shapeshifter as they will work the same but I like this better

Empusa (Cult Support)
Abilities:
- May visit any player every night

Attributes:
- Anybody is who visits his target will get the notification "You saw an Empusa, and fleed", getting no results that night
- Transporter will still switch
- Will stop people from visiting veteran
- Cult members may visit the target of the Empusa and will not flee

The Empusa was a demigoddess that transformed from a beautiful woman into a scary monster. She was said to be subject to Hekate, so it fits perfectly with the lore of the faction. Basically this is my version of the consort, but it is pretty different


I haven't gotten any real feedback since my first 6 roles, now I have 10(If yoy include the post just before as well)
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Re: Cult (Faction) (NEED FEEDBACK!)

Postby AmericanMexican » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:48 pm

Gooose26 wrote:IMPORTANT: As a mafia faction, meaning that it would take the place of mafia if rolled in, the cult will take up 3 role slots in a ranked game. Instead of Godfather, Mafioso, Random Mafia, it will instead be; Cleric, Deformer, Random Cult. Also, random cult cannot be the Cleric or Deformer. Keep that in mind as you read this. Hope you enjoy! For Hekate! - Gooose

Faction Lore:
Spoiler: Today is the full moon, the only time that when the Cult can see there powerful Goddess, Hekate. They believe that Hekate wants them to take over the Town of Salem, as a token to prove their worth. Because of this, they will go to no ends to take the town, even by cold-blooded murder. Give in to the Cult, or die trying. There is no other answer.

To-Do List:
Spoiler: Short Term:
- Finish lore for each individual role
- Get more mutations/deformities
- GET ACTUAL FEEDBACK!!!
- Add Sample Text to each role

Long Term:
- Add achievements to each role
- Replace roles that are very similar to in-game roles/Make faction different than the mafia/Create more roles
- Get into testing grounds
- Get into the game


Common Information:
Spoiler: Goal:
Kill anybody who doesn't bow before the old gods

Wins With:
Wins with Survivors
Wins with Witches

Special Attributes:
- All members of the Cult, who cannot kill, have the ability to become Cutthroats if there are no living roles that can kill
- All members of the Cult may talk to each other at night
- Bite immune


Investigative Results:
Spoiler: Escort, Transporter, Empusa, or Consort

Investigator, Consigliere, Scholar, or Mayor

Sheriff, Executioner, Cutthroat, or Werewolf

Vigilante, Veteran, Mafioso, or Deformer

Lookout, Forger, or Amnesiac

Spy, Blackmailer, Necromancer, or Jailor

Doctor, Disguiser, Mortician, or Serial Killer

BodyGuard, Godfather, Cleric, or Arsonist

Medium, Janitor, Ritualist, or Retributionist

Survivor, Vampire Hunter, or Witch

Framer, Prevaricator, Vampire, Jester(Framed message)
Aright seems decent enough, they all get scum claims in a way, for the most part. Some might be damaged but their roles will be used and over by then


Cleric: (With new lore!)
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Support)

Abilities:
- Every full moon, the Cleric may choose to mutate 1 mutation for the Deformer
- May only give 1 mutation if 2 deformities are also given
- May get rid of 1 deformity every non-full moon

Attributes:
- Unique
- May not exist without a Deformer
- If the Deformer dies, then the Cleric will develop night immunity and the ability to kill 1 player each night
This is pretty sweet! So it is like an underpowered Godfather but it serves to make the Deformer an overpowered Godfather.
Lore:
Yesterday was the blood moon. This is the only day when the Cleric can speak directly to Selene.
Selene, Goddess of the moon. She didn't say much to him but he knew immediately after his encounter, what he had to do. He had to take back the town of Salem.
Not many were willing to follow the path of the Cleric, claiming he was crazy, a fool, or even a witch. But some fell before the truth and followed. These few will be rewarded for their obedience, as they will take back the town, and be spared by their leader, Hekate, Goddess of all things magic. She will lead them to the dark, the most powerful place of all.
But with her guidance and the undying obedience of the cult, nobody will be able to stop her from ruling Salem, once again.


Deformer: (Entered to be in a role competition)
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Killing)

Abilities:
- Starts out being able to attack 1 player every night

Attributes:
- Unique
- May be mutated by the Cleric.
- Only is mutated on full moons. To receive a mutation, you must receive 2 deformities first.
- 1 deformity may be demutated on non-full moons
So a mafioso that evolves, alright
Lore:
The Deformer used to be a normal citizen of Salem, but he say the truth in the preachings of the Cleric.
He was once normal as well, but gave up his face and hands to praise Hekate. Now he was just a deformed man being used by the Cleric as a monster of destruction.
He seeks his destiny through Hephaestus, a deformed God. As Hephaestus was lame, he was ugly. But nonetheless Hephaestus was successful and helped equip the gods with tools and armor.
The Cleric is giving him all the armor he needs, not just deformities, and the Deformer will forever be greatful. To pay back Hekate, he will do her biddings. And right now, she needs to take back Salem.


Empusa
Spoiler: Role Alginment:
Cult (Support)

Abilities:
- May visit any player every night

Attributes:
- Anybody is who visits his target will get the notification "You saw an Empusa, and fleed", getting no results that night
- Transporter will still switch
- Will stop people from visiting Veteran
- Cult members may visit the target of the Empusa and will not flee
So stops the ability to not kill every night as this would stop town protectives, but then it can't be escort-like. Or it can be more like a consort that can get more than 1 person roleblocked every night / can defend a cult member from being discovered at all
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Necromancer:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Support)

Abilities:
- May talk to the dead at night
- All dead players may talk back to the Necromancer
- Can talk to the Cult even when dead
So a mafia medium, how original
Attributes:
- The dead will not know who you are and see you as a "Medium"
- May call upon the moon to communicate with the Cult at night. May do this twice.
- When talking to the Cult after dead, he may not talk to the dead but can still hear them
- Can read whispers during the day
- Can switch between cult chat and dead chat at the top of the screen
Oh so it is like the communicator guy. Gets whisper information as well as dead information and can pass it onto the cultists
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Ritualist:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Deception)

Abilities:
- May steal the soul from any player every full moon
- May only take 2 souls, but may use as many charges as neccesary until 2 souls are taken.
Essentially a copy of the janitor, wow
Attributes:
- Taken souls will be given the role of "TAKEN" in the graveyard and the will won't be shown
- The souls may not talk for 2 days after they are killed
Oh so an overpowered janitor. I feel like the mafia would be safe from the medium for too long and guaranteed 2 players is too strong even though it is 1 less than the janitor #nooriginality -_- Although a faction seems pretty hard to make so I guess I shouldn't judge too hard
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Scholar:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Support)

Abilities:
- May ask the moon about 1 person each full moon, learning their Faction(Town, Cult, or Neutral)
- On non-full moons, may research 2 people, learning their alignment type(Killing/Evil, Protective, Support/Benign, Investigative/Deception)
Cool rework for a mafia investigative. I think it is pretty balanced like this.
Attributes:
- When you know the faction and alignment of 1 player, then you will be given their actual role as "Your target must be a ___!"
Can essentially turn into a consigliere n2 as well as get a whole bunch of alignments on-top. Now this has become overpowered
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Prevaricator:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Deception)

Abilities:
- Every night, may choose somebody to appear as a Cultist to the Sheriff, and may choose what results the Investigator will find if he visits the target
- May target anybody, including a Cultist
- Likewise, the Prevaricator will be able to choose how he appears to an Investigator as well
- If he decides to visit a Cult member, then that player will appear as not suspicious to the Sheriff

Attributes:
- Doesn't appear as a cultist to the Sheriff
I like this, cool take from the framer? Whatever, can help the mafia sustain itself for more killing and evolutions. Can definitely get somebody killed if you just switch the role appearance and he gets investigated, but can save a cultist with protection
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Sophist:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Support)

Abilities:
- Every night, may choose 1 player and can guess 2 roles that the player might be
- If guessed correctly, then the player will be roleblocked for 2 nights
- If guessed incorrectly, the Sophist will be roleblocked for 2 nights instead
Can become an overpowered consort if a townie gets confirmed. The fact that they will still use their ability because they are unaware is just too overpowered to me. I do like how he doesn't know what's going so he cannot find bluffs is good, but I think waiting for a confirmed townie is too reliable
Attributes:
- The Sophist/target will not know if they are roleblocked until after the 2 nights are over
- Players will think that they did their role, but nothing will happen or they will still waste a charge if used
- Only 3 charges
I guess that a few charges makes it better than before, but still
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Mortician:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Deception)

Abilities:
- May visit 1 player each night, and if that target is killed then the target will appear to be alive the next day
- Any attacker that kills the player will get the message, "Your target was immune!"
- The target will only look alive for the next day, but may be visited again to look alive again

Attributes:
- Only has 5 charges
- Sheriff and Investigator will find out that the player is in fact dead, but the lookout will only see who visited
It seems pretty good how it is, and I think it is fair that investigating will tell them they are in fact dead is fair. Will this affect the overall voting count or not, because then ranked players will notice the voting change, but as well the non vote change could mess up the town too much
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Oracle
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult (Support)

Abilities:
- Every night may choose to go on *alert*(Will find a better word)
- When on alert, anybody who visits a cultist will be shown by what role they are

Attributes:
- If somebody had visited a cultist at all before, the roles will be shown and the name of the player, but seperately
- Only 3 charges
So cult lookout that can tell the cult who did what. Will the oracle find out who was visited or just that members were all visited by these roles.
Lore:(Coming soon!)


Cutthroat:
Spoiler: Role Alignment:
Cult(Killing)

Abilities:
- May kill 1 player every night

Attributes:
- If there are no more killing roles left in the Cult, then a Cult member will turn into a Cutthroat
Simple mafioso, that's fine
Lore:(Coming soon!)

Note: This won't be a random cultist, but instead will only show up if all killing roles are dead


Mutations/Deformities:(Need more! Suggestions please!!!)
Spoiler: Mutations:

Strength of the Moon - Night Immunity
Dark Side of the Moon - Will not come up as a Cult member to Sheriff
Undying Anger - Attacks go through night immunity
Relentless Fury - Can't be roleblocked by an Escort
Speed of Sycnja - Will not be seen by Lookout
Foresight - Will see who visited his target

Deformities:

Death Wish - Cleric will die in 3 days(May not be demutated)
Exposure - Investigator will see Deformer as a member of the Cult(Like Sheriff)
Mark of Disapproval - May not talk during the day
Unwanted - May not vote
Accidental Selection - The last mutated perk will be demutated
Uncontrollable - Will kill the roleblocker when roleblocked

Only 6 means that the average game will reach the maximum, I feel like more should be added. I like how this cult uses their gained information to work around what they know. Like oh no spy? Get a spy deformity and lookout mutation to go past the known lookout. Know vote for roles will need to take a step back...
Gamemodes:(WARNING: Very Long!) (Still in beta mode, but feedback will help)
Spoiler: Ranked/Ranked Practice:
Jailor
Town (Investigative)
Town (Investigative)
Town (Support)
Town (Support)
Town (Killing)
Town (Protective)
Random Town
Cleric
Deformer
Random Cult
Neutral (Killing)
Neutral (Evil)
Neutral (Benign)
Any
Fits right in, sweet
Faction War:
Jailor
Mayor
Town (Investigative)
Town (Investigative)
Town (Support)
Town (Killing)
Town (Protective)
Town (Protective)
Random Town
Godfather
Mafioso
Random Mafia
Cleric
Deformer
Random Cult
Could be fun, no suggestions though
Cult vs. Mafia:
Godfather
Mafioso
Random Mafia
Random Mafia
Random Mafia
Cleric
Deformer
Random Cult
Random Cult
Random Cult
Neutral (Killing)
Neutral (Killing)
Neutral (Evil)
Neutral (Evil)
Neutral (Benign)

Still can be fun but more of a slug fest based off of the evils and killings and who they visit though. Wont be for elo or anything
Change Log:
Spoiler: 1/21/17 - Faction created(In the Faction Development Thread)
1/26/17 - Some more roles
1/30/17 - Balancing
1/31/17 - Created new thread
2/3/17 - Added faction lore
2/4/17 - Mutation balances, new names, and prettier page
2/5/17 - Added Prevaricator role
2/13/17 - Added Sophist role
2/17/17 - Added Mortician role
2/21/17 - Replaced the Shapeshifter with the Empusa
2/22/17 - Added possible cult gamemodes
2/23/17 - Added Oracle role
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Re: Cult (Faction) (NEED FEEDBACK!)

Postby Salamandos35 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 11:36 pm

I'm not the guy who made this, but:

Oracle just gets a pile of visitor names I'm pretty sure. No indication of who visited who.

The "medium copy" and "janitor copy"... medium is something that doesn't have a strong evil CC and janitor is just a good role which is essential/useful enough to justify recycling.

Scholar is less OP than you think because it only gets half as many roles/night as consig does. Sure, it gets alignments, but those are worth a lot less.

Mortician - Since the Mortician can't do anything with his puppet, the reasonable option probably means not counting it for vote purposes. It'll be noticed, but then you have to figure out who the puppet is...
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Re: Cult (Faction) (NEED FEEDBACK!)

Postby Gooose26 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 11:51 pm

Salamandos35 wrote:I'm not the guy who made this, but:

Oracle just gets a pile of visitor names I'm pretty sure. No indication of who visited who.

The "medium copy" and "janitor copy"... medium is something that doesn't have a strong evil CC and janitor is just a good role which is essential/useful enough to justify recycling.

Scholar is less OP than you think because it only gets half as many roles/night as consig does. Sure, it gets alignments, but those are worth a lot less.

Mortician - Since the Mortician can't do anything with his puppet, the reasonable option probably means not counting it for vote purposes. It'll be noticed, but then you have to figure out who the puppet is...


No, the Oracle will first get, Player A cultist was visited by an invesigator and transporter, Player B....

But if somebody visits again to another it will be;
Player A cultist was visited by a lookout and the doctor, Player B...
"You recognize a face. It belongs to [Visitors name here]!"

Yea the medium copy thing is a lot different than the normal medium and it converted to an evil role, which CC's the medium. As the Janitor there is a good argument that it is copied but I feel like it was alreasy a super good role and it is hard to change that without ruining the balance of it.

I do feel the scholar is balanced, sure he can get pure answers every other day and 1 alignment, but hat is actually worse than the consigliere. The way I would do it is that you would only revisit somebody if yoy need to know something to help with the Deformer mutations going on, and instead get information on 3 people every 2 days. Also, I would use the double visit when I would find a neutral player.

Yea Salamando's got it. It won't affect the number of votes, which sure hardcore players will notice(Personally I never even notice the "this many votes for voting up" thing until we are at a standstill and almost voting somebody up), but they cant find the puppet througg this. Discovering the puppet is really just a waste of your night though, unless you are lookout and find out it was a puppet...

I definitely enjoy the feedback though, I will take note of it, from both of you

EDIT: I also noticed how it would require both the Defotmer and the Cleric to be alive to night 6 in order to hit max deformities/mutations, which is highly unlikely and should be rewarded well. But i dont think more are needed because of this.
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