Shadowalker (Neutral Killing)

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Shadowalker (Neutral Killing)

Postby murat1996 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:18 pm

Role Name: Shadowalker

Role Alignment: Neutral Killing

Ability: Choose to walk in someone's Shadow each night, Killing whoever they visit

Attributes:
- Killing whoever your target visits will be an astral attack.
- If your target doesn't visit that night, they will be attacked directly.
- If you target scum, they will be attacked directly.
- Direct attacks will not be an Astral Attack.
- Lookout can only see you when you do a direct attack.

Goal: Kill everyone in your path.

Win conditions:
-Wins with the Witches
-Wins with the Survivors
-Wins with other Shadowalkers
-Must Kill the Town
-Must Kill the Mafia
-Must kill the Arsonists
-Must kill the Werewolves
-Must kill the Serial Killers
You may spare anyone else

Special Attributes: Night immunity.

Stats:
Attack is basic
Defense is basic
Priority is 5th

Story: Unknown

Sheriff: Your target is not suspicious
Investigator: Your target sticks to the shadows they must be a Lookout, Forger,Amnesiac or a Shadowalker
Consigliere: Your target lurks in the shadows of others, they must be the Shadowalker


Additional Info:
nada

I had to repost this, apologies for it being rushed, but its done.
Last edited by murat1996 on Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:08 pm, edited 15 times in total.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Mace8937 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:19 pm

Why did you repost it?
I think its time for a fucking Crusade

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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby RetralMega » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:20 pm

I support this entirely.

Not sure why you didn't just bump the original one though.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:22 pm

RetralMega wrote:I support this entirely.

Not sure why you didn't just bump the original one though.


Umm I had to delete the original thread, because of one thing.

But I like that, you support it
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby RetralMega » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:22 pm

murat1996 wrote:
RetralMega wrote:I support this entirely.

Not sure why you didn't just bump the original one though.


Umm I had to delete the original thread, because of one thing.

But I like that, you support it

I know right? It's rare I actually like something.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:25 pm

Mace8937 wrote:Why did you repost it?


The original thread had too many unnecessary comments. (Not the critics, just in general)
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Kirize12 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:43 pm

SK with no control over kills, still /nosupport this.
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

Strategical balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because there's no reason to use any other strategy

Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

This matters - educate yourself.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:46 pm

Kirize12 wrote:SK with no control over kills, still /nosupport this.


Give me a better idea then ;)
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Elux666 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:47 pm

it's kinda like a buffed SK/MAFIOSO who is undetectable to the lookout and unkillable by the BG, you'd have to give them some kind of weakness

but I like the idea of it!
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:50 pm

Elux666 wrote:it's kinda like a buffed SK/MAFIOSO who is undetectable to the lookout and unkillable by the BG, you'd have to give them some kind of weakness

but I like the idea of it!


You can still be caught by a Lookout if you attack your target directly.

You can still be killed by a Bodyguard that you didn't follow.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby RetralMega » Wed Apr 13, 2016 7:50 pm

Best way to make this role completely fair would be to remove night immunity. It would still be a good role, even without it.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Nellyfox » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:00 pm

Remember that posts must have some sort of substance and related to the role, thanks.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Kirize12 » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:01 pm

RetralMega wrote:Best way to make this role completely fair would be to remove night immunity. It would still be a good role, even without it.

Last post got removed. boring

Either way, terrible idea. All NK's need night immunity to properly function.
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

Strategical balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because there's no reason to use any other strategy

Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

This matters - educate yourself.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Wzombie » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:41 pm

What are the interactions with Vet?
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby RetralMega » Wed Apr 13, 2016 8:55 pm

Wzombie wrote:What are the interactions with Vet?

If your target visits the Vet while on alert, you will kill the Vet and the vet will kill your target, but you will be unseen by Lookouts. If you target a Vet and they go on alert, I assume you die rather than kill them and live.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Jerme » Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:08 pm

As far as I remember: Vet alerts and Shadowalker dies, no matter if he targetted the Vet directly or followed someone to there. The Veteran will not die since they are nightimmune...
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Thu Apr 14, 2016 5:56 am

What is there to change?
My FM Record: 26-28-2

https://docs.google.com/document/d/19iy ... p=drivesdk

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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby simabean » Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:57 pm

It's an interesting idea, but it's just a SK who doesn't know who to kill (but is undetectable by lookout)
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Deldris » Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:15 pm

How does this interact with WW?

If you follow somebody who visits the WW target, do you also die?
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Sat Apr 16, 2016 3:26 pm

simabean wrote:It's an interesting idea, but it's just a SK who doesn't know who to kill (but is undetectable by lookout)


Only half of the time with Lookout.


Deldris wrote:How does this interact with WW?

If you follow somebody who visits the WW target, do you also die?


Yes.

If you visited a ww targeting someone, you will die as well.

WW kills you in every scenario.

You may get a kill, but it would be for nothing.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby RetralMega » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:19 pm

After further evaluation, I cannot support this role.

It's a hardcounter to Lookout.
It's a hardcounter to Bodyguard.

Those two reasons are enough for me to not like this role.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby GifttheGiver » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:21 pm

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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby simabean » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:27 pm

RetralMega wrote:After further evaluation, I cannot support this role.

It's a hardcounter to Lookout.
It's a hardcounter to Bodyguard.

Those two reasons are enough for me to not like this role.

I can see two easy ways to fix both of these problems.
- Make it detectable by lookout when you kill your target's target.
- Make them effected as normal if their target is being bodyguarded.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby Kirize12 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:42 pm

RetralMega wrote:After further evaluation, I cannot support this role.

It's a hardcounter to Lookout.
It's a hardcounter to Bodyguard.

Those two reasons are enough for me to not like this role.

It is neither. The problem with it is that it is an RNG SK, and it's a problem that can't be fixed.
Factional balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because they cause Town to win a disproportionate amount

Strategical balance - understanding that whisper games are bad because there's no reason to use any other strategy

Structural balance - understanding that disabling the Mayor's whispers, despite it fixing whisper games, means that a player can't use a core mechanic of the game and is still bad

This matters - educate yourself.
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Re: Shadowalker (Neutral Killing) Repost

Postby murat1996 » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:43 pm

Kirize12 wrote:
RetralMega wrote:After further evaluation, I cannot support this role.

It's a hardcounter to Lookout.
It's a hardcounter to Bodyguard.

Those two reasons are enough for me to not like this role.

It is neither. The problem with it is that it is an RNG SK, and it's a problem that can't be fixed.


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