Vampire Hunter - [Rework]

[RiceHatMan]

Role Name:
Vampire Hunter

Role Alignment:
Neutral (Chaos)

Abilities:
- During the night, you may choose to check someone
- In addition to your main ability, you may also decide to use incense

Attributes:
- You will be notified whether or not your target is a Vampire or not
- If you decide to use incense, all Vampires visits directed towards you or your target will be negated. If your target is a Vampire, they will be role blocked. Vampires will be notified if their visit was cancelled or if they were role blocked, but you won't
- Unless you use incense, if a Vampire tries to bite you, you will attack your attacker instead of checking your original target. You will survive the attack
- After all Vampires have died, you will gain a permanent Basic defense

Notifications:
- You will receive "A Vampire tried to bite you, so you staked them instead!" if you were attacked by a Vampire without using incense
- A Vampire will receive "You were repelled by an incense!" if their visit was negated or if they were role blocked by your incense


Goal:
Live to see the Vampires lose.

Win Conditions:
You must kill Vampires
You win with Town
You win with Mafia
You win with Serial Killers
You win with Arsonists
You win with Werewolves
You win with Survivors
You win with Witches
You may spare anyone else

Special Attributes:
- Attack: Basic
- Defense: None/Basic when all Vampires are dead

Investigator Results:
Sheriff - You cannot find evidence of wrongdoing. Your target seems innocent.
Investigator - Your target could be a Survivor, Vampire Hunter, Amnesiac, Medusa, or Psychic.
Consigliere - Your target tracks Vampires. They must be a Vampire Hunter!.

Achievements:
Same as original

Additional Information:
You will counterattack Vampires even if you are role blocked. You will not be able to read Vampire chat. You will still be able to check players after all Vampires have died, and you will still retain your Basic defense if there are new Vampires from Amnesiacs or a Necromancer

Lore:
Same as original, with the exception of being neutral instead of doing it for good.

[cob709]

Oh this would be a good idea! Instead of killing vampires, it repels their attacks instead, making the VH less OP.
This prevents the VH from clutching and absolutely demolishing vampires, but also gives VH a fair chance to prevent them from taking over the town.
I'm not sure moving it to Neutral Chaos is a good choice, but I think it would still work out pretty well.

I think this is a good rework.
/support

[RiceHatMan]

Oh this would be a good idea! Instead of killing vampires, it repels their attacks instead, making the VH less OP.
This prevents the VH from clutching and absolutely demolishing vampires, but also gives VH a fair chance to prevent them from taking over the town.
I'm not sure moving it to Neutral Chaos is a good choice, but I think it would still work out pretty well.

I think this is a good rework.
/support

I moved this to Neutral (Chaos) because Vampire Hunter isn't treated as town in gamemodes like All Any. Although Vampires are a bigger threat to Town than to other factions, other factions will still leave you alone and not lynch you until they think Town needs to lose majority, because would rather you eliminate another group and not have to deal with that group anymore than kill a single town. In this rework, no one will want to lynch or kill you except for Vampires, since you can now win with everyone else, instead of other factions waiting for you to convert to a Vigilante to kill you.

[TheUltimateCake]

Your new VH gains basic defence for no reason after winning, also it doesn't have a reliable way to kill Vampires, and Vampires cannot kill it, which is a problem with current VH. Vh should have an option to kill Vampires [as a limited use], and there should be a way for Vampires to kill the VH.

[RiceHatMan]

Your new VH gains basic defence for no reason after winning, also it doesn't have a reliable way to kill Vampires, and Vampires cannot kill it, which is a problem with current VH. Vh should have an option to kill Vampires [as a limited use], and there should be a way for Vampires to kill the VH.

Since this role needs to live until the end of the game, the Basic defense encourages this reworked role to kill the Vampires are fast as possible. I don't see why this role needs to kill, feel free to explain. Vampires don't need to be able to kill them, and instead focus on gaining majority, I see no problem with that. It was a problem because Vampires Hunter could kill Vampires with ease, and I don't see how giving a way to kill Vampires as an ability would help this case.

[TheUltimateCake]

Oh, thought that this VH only needed to see the vampires die, but I don't think VH should have to survive after killing all vamps, since it's basically a Survivor with perm basic defence at that point. So, a better win con would be "Live to see all the Vampires die." Also, VH should have a way to kill Vampires, as it's goal, is literally to kill them, while not making it as OP as current VH, and another thing is that Vampires should have a way to deal with it's hard counter, and shouldn't be helpless to a VH.

[cob709]

Vampire Hunter can HELP prevent Vampires from gaining majority, one single player should not be capable of wiping out an entire faction.

[RiceHatMan]

Oh, thought that this VH only needed to see the vampires die, but I don't think VH should have to survive after killing all vamps, since it's basically a Survivor with perm basic defence at that point. So, a better win con would be "Live to see all the Vampires die." Also, VH should have a way to kill Vampires, as it's goal, is literally to kill them, while not making it as OP as current VH, and another thing is that Vampires should have a way to deal with it's hard counter, and shouldn't be helpless to a VH.

Witch has to live to see Town lose, yet they cannot directly kill Town. Same with this role. You could say Witch has others to help, and same with this role. Only the Vampires want the Vampires to win, no one else. The win condition you just suggested is the same as mine. Vampires aren't helpless to a VH, as the VH isn't with town anymore nor can they directly kill Vampires, meaning other factions might not be willing to help the Vampire Hunter and let the Vampires and Vampire Hunter do their own business. For example, Town would rather lynch a Godfather than help you lynch a Vampire, since you don't need to win with Town anymore. The reason why I made Vampire Hunter need to live to the end of the game is so it forces them to make alliances early on and so they are pressured to killing off the Vampires as fast as possible. More importantly, they can actually do something once an Amnesiac or Necromancer brings back a Vampire, and not just hope the other factions do something about it.

[TheUltimateCake]

That's because Witch is Neutral Evil, and VH should have a way to kill Vampires. Maybe a limited use ability like some have suggested in the past. Also, I don't think it should have to survive after it kills all the vamps, and should just win after all the Vampires die. Vampires are kinda useless to this VH since it's basically immune to everything they can throw at it, as your version is basically a Sheriff and Escort directed towards Vampires, so they should have a way to deal with it.

[RiceHatMan]

That's because Witch is Neutral Evil, and VH should have a way to kill Vampires. Maybe a limited use ability like some have suggested in the past. Also, I don't think it should have to survive after it kills all the vamps, and should just win after all the Vampires die. Vampires are kinda useless to this VH since it's basically immune to everything they can throw at it, as your version is basically a Sheriff and Escort directed towards Vampires, so they should have a way to deal with it.

Firstly, Vampire Hunter is only immune to bites. It's not like Vampires cannot lynch them at the end of the game. The thing is, the same thing applies to Executioner. When Retributionist used to revive their target, they would have to lynch them again to win. Same with this role. I added the "live to the end" simply because this isn't a Neutral (Evil). Please explain why Witch has to live to the end of the game because they are Neutral (Evil)? I don't see how that correlates.

[TheUltimateCake]

1. Executioner didn't have to get their target rehung to win. 2. Witch's whole thing is that it's ability and alignment is to help evils, which is why it's considered Neutral Evil, and VH's goal is one that usually helps Town. 3. Making it have to live to the end will make it much harder to win, especially since it doesn't have a way to kill the people it's supposed to be hunting. 4. Other factions can kill TIs that are trying to find them, while Vampires can't kill the TI after them.

[RiceHatMan]

1. Executioner didn't have to get their target rehung to win. 2. Witch's whole thing is that it's ability and alignment is to help evils, which is why it's considered Neutral Evil, and VH's goal is one that usually helps Town. 3. Making it have to live to the end will make it much harder to win, especially since it doesn't have a way to kill the people it's supposed to be hunting. 4. Other factions can kill TIs that are trying to find them, while Vampires can't kill the TI after them.

I didn't know Executioner didn't have to get their target rehung to win. I see why Witches are considered a Neutral (Evil), but I am asking why that correlates to them needing to live to the end of the game? Witches don't have a way to kill the people they are hunting, so I don't see why that is a problem. I think that it is fair that Vampires cannot kill the Vampire Hunter through biting, that's because it's the only way to find Vampires other than scum reading, since they can convert. Vampires are quite over-powered, that is why there is a hard counter to them in the first place, albeit a little too powerful as a hard counter. It makes perfect sense to not be able to be converted, since that is what makes Vampires over-powered in the first place. This role negates Vampires to the extent that they are still in par with other factions, which this role does fine, since they cannot be converted, which is what makes Vampires over-powered. Vampire Hunter's goal helps everyone, everyone wants the Vampires dead. Also, Vampire Hunter is Neutral (Chaos) and not Neutral (Evil) for a reason.

[DiamondRanger8]

I like this. It makes more sense for Vampire Hunter to be a neutral instead of town. This seems more like a Neutral Evil to me, but it makes sense for it to be Neutral Chaos, so it can't show up in ranked.

[RiceHatMan]

I like this. It makes more sense for Vampire Hunter to be a neutral instead of town. This seems more like a Neutral Evil to me, but it makes sense for it to be Neutral Chaos, so it can't show up in ranked.

I made it Neutral Chaos because it doesn't fit any other Neutral alignment. It isn't necessarily out there to hurt Town, and it also isn't supposed to kill every other faction, so it shouldn't be Neutral (Evil) nor Neutral (Killing) respectively. Neutral (Chaos) is also the "other" alignment, and Vampire Hunter is in there because Vampires are there too.