Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

Kitsune Role Idea

Great! No tweaks needed.
6
26%
A few tweaks, but otherwise pretty good. (suggest tweaks if you choose this option)
6
26%
A lot of tweaks are needed. (again, suggest tweaks if you choose this option)
3
13%
The base idea is flawed. Just move on...
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35%
 
Total votes : 23

Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:13 pm

Role Name:
Kitsune

Role Alignment:
Neutral(Killing)

Abilities:
-You can trick people into entering your lair every night. You choose the target on Day 2.
-You cannot kill on regular (non-Full Moon) nights. This includes your target's killing option.

Attributes:
-You have Basic defense.
-Your lair acts like jail. If someone attempts to visit your target while you have them in your lair, they will receive the notification, “Your ability failed because your target was in jail.”
-You can choose to devour them, dealing a Powerful attack.
-You can also charm your target into doing a favor for you. These include roleblocking or attacking (which deals a Basic attack, and has three charges). However, your target may choose anyone to use their action on. (This excludes you and the target, so the target cannot suicide nor harm you in any way, since they have been charmed by you. They will receive "your target's defense was too strong" if they choose to attack you, and they will receive "your target is immune to roleblocking" if they choose to roleblock you)

Notifications:
Target: “You have been hauled off to a Kitsune’s lair!”
Kitsune: “You have hauled your target off to your lair!”
Target: “You have been charmed into roleblocking a target of your choice!”
Target: “You have been charmed into attacking a target of your choice!”
Target: “You have been devoured by a Kitsune!”
Target: “You have died!”
Kitsune: “Someone tried to roleblock you, but you were immune!”

Goal:
-Kill everyone who would oppose you.

Win Conditions:
You win with the Kitsune
You win with Survivors
You win with Witches
You must kill anyone else.

Special Attributes:
-Roleblock immune
-Priority: 1
-Unique

Investigator Results:
Sheriff - Your target is suspicious!
Investigator - Your target could be an Escort, Consort, Transporter, (Hypnotist), or a Kitsune.
Consigliere - Your target tricks people using charm. They must be a Kitsune.

Achievements:
Tricked! - Trick someone into entering your lair. 20 MP
Foxish Appetite - Devour someone. 20 MP
Kitsune’s Charm - Charm someone into roleblocking a target. 20 MP
Kitsune’s Wrath - Charm someone into attacking a target. 20 MP
Wisdom and Trickery - Win 1 game as a Kitsune. 20 MP
Charming Tricks - Win 5 games as a Kitsune. 20 MP
Foxy Deceiver - Win 10 games as a Kitsune. 40 MP
Legendary Trickster - Win 25 games as a Kitsune. 100 MP

Additional Information:
I accept feedback! If this role is too similar to the Siren, I’ll change it! Criticism is always appreciated, although you should specify which aspects of the role you would like me to change, and how you would replace the mechanics.
If the Jailor jails a Kitsune, the Kitsune's target will be hauled off to their lair, but nothing will happen.

Lore:
A bitter, young woman had died. She had been known for her slyness, and once she had passed away, the Town collectively sighed in relief. The woman could've been working with the Mafia, after all! Unfortunately for them, this Town is full of mystical creatures, and the deceased woman was no different. Angry at the Town for shunning her intelligence, the woman took the form of a beautiful, charming new-comer to the Town.

"Someone has arrived in the Town!" the Lookout exclaimed, his sharp eyes noticing every movement first.

"Really?" the Mayor asked rhetorically, puzzled. "This Town is notorious for its crime."

"You really must see her. She's almost as fabulous as me," the Escort piped up.

With that, the new-comer was an instant favorite with the Town, although the eagle-eyed Lookout and the crafty Godfather noticed her eyes narrowed in suspicion half the time, almost as if saying something menacing. If stares could kill, this woman's gaze would be a mass-murderer. Noting such things, the Lookout and Godfather went on with their days.

The woman was ready. She had to make her strike against the Town soon. In the form of a multi-tailed fox, she snuck up to the Investigator's house. Shifting back into a human, the vengeful "ghost" smiled menacingly as she entered the Investigator's house in a kitsune mask, charming him like the Escort. Before the Investigator knew what was happening, he was in the woman's lair.

"W-what are you?!" the Investigator yelled as the "ghost" slid off her mask. Her smile was menacing, and her eyes pierced through the dark lair.

The Investigator stood no chance. The woman leaped at him, instantly killing him. After devouring him, the woman finally answered the Investigator's question.

"I am the Kitsune."

Please provide feedback.

Changelog:

  • Reverted a suggestion, as I realized the capabilities of a Kitsune claiming Escort
  • Added Lore and some extra balancing factors
  • Added a feature to do with the Jailor
  • Made sure the Kitsune's BBCode color actually worked
  • Removed the blackmail immunity
Last edited by dolphina on Thu Jul 09, 2020 10:11 am, edited 12 times in total.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby cob709 » Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:44 pm

dolphina wrote:Role Name:
Abilities:
-You can trick people into entering your lair every full moon night. You choose the target on Day 2.

Okay, so this sounds like a jailor limited by the full moon, sounds good so far.

dolphina wrote:Attributes:
-Your lair acts like jail.
-You can choose to devour them, dealing a Powerful attack.
-You can also charm your target into doing a favor for you. These include roleblocking or attacking. However, your target may choose anyone to use their action on

Okay well here's the problem: if their target is "charmed", then the player would learn the name of the Kitsune and would be able to expose them. Do these charms apply to the night they are "jailed" or the night after? And can the Kitsune talk to their target? Also, because the target cannot attack the Kitsune, that means they would know who the Kitsune is and would be exposed.
Also, maybe make the Kitsune a Unique role?

dolphina wrote:Notifications:
Target: “You have been hauled off to a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]’s lair!”
[color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]: “You have hauled off your target to your lair!”
Target: “You have been charmed into roleblocking a target of your choice!”
Target: “You have been charmed into attacking a target of your choice!”
Target: “You have been devoured by a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]!”
Target: “You have died!”
Kitsune: “Someone tried to roleblock you, but you were immune!”
Kitsune: “Someone tried to blackmail you, but you were immune!”

Notifications work well.

dolphina wrote:Goal:
-Kill everyone who would oppose you.

Win Conditions:
You win with Kitsunes
You win with Survivors
You win with Witches
You must kill anyone else.

Yep all good.

dolphina wrote:Special Attributes:
-Roleblock immune
-Blackmail immune (the Blackmailer will get the “Your ability failed because your target was in jail!” message)
-Priority: 1

If the BMer gets the message that their target was in jail, and someone else visits the Kitsune, then they would be exposed. Roleblock immunity should probably be removed because jailor isn't immune to roleblock either.

dolphina wrote:Investigator Results:
[color=00BF00]Sheriff[/color] - Your target is suspicious!
[color=00BF00]Investigator - Your target could be an [color=00BF00]Escort[/color], [color=FF0000]Consort[/color], [color=00BF00]Transporter[/color], or a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color].
[color=FF0000]Consigliere[/color] - Your target tricks people using charm. They must be a Kitsune.

Maybe it would be better to have the investigative result as "Spy, Blackmailer, Jailor, or Kitsune" because the Kitsune has the ability of a jailor and is BMer immune.

dolphina wrote:Achievements:
Tricked! - Trick someone into entering your lair. 20 MP
Foxish Appetite - Devour someone. 20 MP
Kitsune’s Charm - Charm someone into roleblocking a target. 20 MP
Kitsune’s Wrath - Charm someone into attacking a target. 20 MP
Wisdom and Trickery - Win 1 game as a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]. 20 MP
Charming Tricks - Win 5 games as a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]. 20 MP
Foxy Deceiver - Win 10 games as a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]. 40 MP
Legendary Trickster - Win 25 games as a [color=00FFBF]Kitsune[/color]. 100 MP

All good.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:29 am

Thanks for the suggestions! To answer your question, yes, it does devour and charm people in its lair in the same night. Kitsunes are not a unique role, because in folklore, kitsunes are yokai that are prevalent creatures.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:33 am

I don't want the Kitsune to be too powerful, so they cannot talk with their target in "jail." It also has roleblock immunity because it simply makes sense. Kitsunes charm people, why would they fall for the same tricks they play? They're also immune to blackmailing because it threatens to reveal secrets they don't really have. Even if they did have those secrets, it's probably just the fact they killed someone. Kitsunes don't particularly care about this, leading to their blackmail immunity. I could add a few roles that are immune to a Kitsune's charms, so the Kitsune must devour them, wasting a good opportunity. I put the Kitsune in Escort, Consort, Transporter because it kind of went along with the Kitsune's role of charming people. It also gives a few more alternatives to the Escort/Transporter branch. I'll accept your suggestion, though!
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:38 pm

bumping because I think more people should provide feedback
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby cob709 » Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:19 pm

So, the Kitsune can charm someone to attack a player for them right? And the target cannot be the Kitsune right? Then if that's the case, the player would know who the Kitsune is.

How do you prevent the Kitsune from being exposed?
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Brilliand » Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:16 pm

An NK that's weaker than the Jailor?

The Jailor is OP for a Town role, but it isn't strong enough to be a solo role!

I think it would be just fine to let the Kitsune jail every night (but not the same person consecutively), and kill more than 50% of the time. How about... 1 execute to start out with, and 1 additional execute every full moon night?

dolphina wrote:I don't want the Kitsune to be too powerful, so they cannot talk with their target in "jail."


Eh, I don't think this is a problem. The only real use the Kitsune would get out of jail-chat is asking for favors.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Fri Jun 19, 2020 7:36 am

Brilliand wrote: I think it would be just fine to let the Kitsune jail every night (but not the same person consecutively), and kill more than 50% of the time. How about... 1 execute to start out with, and 1 additional execute every full moon night?


Sure! The "executes" are called devouring. I'm planning on having the icon for death be like a traditional Kitsune mask or something.
Anyway, I'll have the Kitsune not able to attack on regular, not Full Moon nights, since I don't want to make this role under/overpowered. It's hard balancing an NK, so I appreciate the feedback!
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Fri Jun 19, 2020 7:42 am

cob709 wrote: How do you prevent the Kitsune from being exposed?


Read the role thing

The Kitsune is a selectable target, but if the charmed person selects the Kitsune, nothing happens. They will receive the notification that the Kitsune's defense was too strong if they choose to attack the Kitsune.

If they choose to roleblock the Kitsune, they'll get the typical notification that their target is immune to roleblocks
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:56 pm

bump for more feedback
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby cob709 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:49 pm

What's going to happen if a jailor targets a Kitsune? Will the Kitsune's ability fail?
What's going to happen if a Kitsune targets a Jailor? Will the Jailor's ability fail?
Either way, both these roles would be exposed if their ability fails.

What's going to happen if they both target each other? Will both abilities fail?
This would also expose both roles.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby cob709 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:50 pm

Probably should make this a Unique Role
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Brilliand » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:00 pm

cob709 wrote:What's going to happen if a jailor targets a Kitsune? Will the Kitsune's ability fail?
What's going to happen if a Kitsune targets a Jailor? Will the Jailor's ability fail?


These can't both be true, because then what happens if both roles target each other at the same time?
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby CrimsonKatana » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:14 pm

:BlobGlare: idk sounds too much like ww to me
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:33 am

cob709 wrote:What's going to happen if a jailor targets a Kitsune? Will the Kitsune's ability fail?
What's going to happen if a Kitsune targets a Jailor? Will the Jailor's ability fail?


Jailor takes priority
Jailor's ability will fail if targeted by a Kitsune

cob709 wrote: Either way, both these roles would be exposed if their ability fails.


I disagree
Jailor is automatically exposed, it has an obvious N1 ability
Kitsune can choose to manipulate its "jailing," covering up the fact the Kitsune was jailed at one point in time
Also if a charmed target kills someone it will say they were attacked by a Serial Killer but there are no conversions those are stupid
Last edited by dolphina on Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:37 am

CrimsonKatana wrote::BlobGlare: idk sounds too much like ww to me


did you even read it just because it's based around the full moon doesn't mean it's like we
-it doesn't rampage
-it doesn't directly attack more than one target (and is confined to attacking one target)
-it acts more like Jailor than ww
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby CrimsonKatana » Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:09 am

This role is bad
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Brilliand » Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:17 pm

dolphina wrote:did you even read it


CrimsonKatana?

I'm guessing he read it and then deliberately said something that didn't make sense. He's mostly a troll, these day.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Tue Jun 23, 2020 3:37 pm

Brilliand wrote:
dolphina wrote:did you even read it


CrimsonKatana?

I'm guessing he read it and then deliberately said something that didn't make sense. He's mostly a troll, these day.


:x
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby KAKERMAN23 » Fri Jun 26, 2020 6:24 am

make it unique
signature

this is a certified floating candle moment

i am female now jsjsjs
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:36 am

Ok
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Robbytherobot » Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:09 pm

This is a good nk idea, it is flexible and seems like it would be tons of fun, allows the nk to have more plays to make the game more refreshing and it doesnt seem op.
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby dolphina » Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:56 pm

Robbytherobot wrote:This is a good nk idea, it is flexible and seems like it would be tons of fun, allows the nk to have more plays to make the game more refreshing and it doesnt seem op.


Thanks! I tried really hard to balance it well!
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Soulshade55r » Mon Jun 29, 2020 6:49 am

I actually think it would lowkey be fine if this would kill every night

Devs are planning to buff all nks anyway, people might look at me like I'm on drugs for saying this but Nks like sk aren't strong enough. (WW and arso too but sk imo is the strongest out of the three)
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Re: Kitsune: Neutral Killing

Postby Robbytherobot » Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:36 am

Maybe it should be able to kill on full moon nights (with its other abilities) but also have its non killing abilities the other nights, but rn this seems fine
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