Jester Update

[AlephCenturion]

Hello!

To whom it may concern,

The role of the Jester I think is a very unique idea and could be very fun! However, there is something that really irks me about it. The fact that they can lynch people who abstain (not inno.) I feel that this is an unfair mechanic because those who abstain are not directly responsible for the jester being lynched and should, therefore, not die because of guilt. Rather, I argue, those who vote guilty should be punishable by the Jester because they are more directly responsible for their lynching.

Furthermore, if only inno-ing saves you from Jester lynch, then the jester could literally survive an entire game for no reason. I think that's a bit absurd and makes it unfairly difficult for town to get rid of them in the absence of jailor or if jailor can no longer execute. Overall, I think it just takes something away from the game at that point since the town would have to put up with a Jester (who, let's face it, is more often than not spamming some nonsense or randomly accusing people anyway.) Which makes the game less fun, rather than more fun.

Please consider changing this mechanic. I think it would improve the game overall.

[KAKERMAN23]

Jester was changed to be able to attack abstaining voters because of the fact that if people suspected that a person on trial was a jester, someone could volunteer to "take the hit" while everyone else abstains. The issue with this was that it not only gave Town a way to unfairly use jesters, it also meant that bad jesters would still be rewarded. If everyone thinks that someone is a jester, why should that jester win? Also, the jester change means not only that evil roles have an excuse to inno their own teammates, but it also means that random lynching is more risky, especially if you are a revealed mayor in late game.

[AlephCenturion]

Jester was changed to be able to attack abstaining voters because of the fact that if people suspected that a person on trial was a jester, someone could volunteer to "take the hit" while everyone else abstains. The issue with this was that it not only gave Town a way to unfairly use jesters, it also meant that bad jesters would still be rewarded. If everyone thinks that someone is a jester, why should that jester win? Also, the jester change means not only that evil roles have an excuse to inno their own teammates, but it also means that random lynching is more risky, especially if you are a revealed mayor in late game.

I have to disagree. I think the system where one person in town can volunteer to "take the hit" is completely valid. Jester should be a niche role that has a difficult time winning. Otherwise you get situations where the jester role will literally spam chat until they hang, especially in the absence of a jailor. There has to be a way to get rid of them that doesn't punish everyone who doesn't vote inno. Honestly, I would prefer if the role was gone entirely as I find it rather pointless but that's just my personal opinion on the role. I still think it needs a massive rework to actually make sense and be valid for play.

[KAKERMAN23]

The problem with taking the hit is that it allows the Town to force the jester to do what they want, which not only gives town an unfair advantage but also sucks some of the fun out of jester. Jester isn't supposed to help town. Town also has the highest win-rate, so if anything, it's better if this detriments Town.

[scarfves]

The whole concept of the Jester is to create fear in every vote. When voting for someone, you have to ask, are they really evil and got caught, or was that on purpose, and creates indecisiveness. If the Jester only killed the guiltier or didn't exist, there would be no need for that for that indecisiveness, giving a big lead to good roles and a major kick to the evil ones. The Jester is more of an unsung hero, similar to an Executioner, roles that don't matter about the endgame of lives or dies, only their target, making them leave a big impact without consequence if they pull it off. When they made it so the Jester couldn't have their target avoid their attack by transport, it wasn't to buff the Jester since a jester already wins, it was to nerf the town, and make it so someone who guiltied could have their life saved by whoever a transporter decided was evil. The Jester creates this weird argument where by buffing him, you instead nerf the town and vice versa. There isn't a problem with a Jester in my eyes, but I wish there was more punishment to him that created that extra layer of fear (Maybe cleaning the wills of his targets would be a nice chance).

[MewNyanFan700]

This was the original Jester. There's a reason they changed it.