Reworks/Buffs

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

Reworks/Buffs

Postby Rivelle » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:30 pm

I've taken a lot of inspirations with my own idea, and I'm going to mash them together and post it here!
I'm striving to balance the roles and make the boring roles more fun.
(Since mafia winrates are low and NK winrates are around 1-5%, I'll be buffing those roles a lot.)

Also... you might see "undecided" next to a change.
Those are changes which I don't know if they should or should not be added.

Please use constructive criticism! Thank you.

If any of the explanations are confusing, I'll be happy to clear any confusion!

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- MAFIA -

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Framer
Change 1 | The framer can frame a non-mafia player with the materials of any mafia member (including yourself).
Change 1: Explanation | If the framer frames the player with the materials of a consort, they will appear suspicious to a sheriff and escort/consort/transporter to an investigator. If they used the materials of a Godfather, they will appear as innocent to a sheriff and bodyguard/arsonist/godfather to an investigator.
Change 2 | Framed players will have their visits listed as a mafia visit to spy results.
Change 2: Explanation | If the framer frames a player and that player visits player #8, then spy will see that #8 was visited by mafia.[/b]
Change 3 | Players framed with the material of a mafia member will be added onto the lookout's result.
Change 3: Explanation | If the Godfather visited a player and a lookout was watching, and if the framer used the Godfather's materials onto another player, then the framed player's name will be added onto the lookout's results.
Change 4 | Spies can't see mafia visits of a player that had their materials taken.
Change 4: Explanation | The Framer uses the Consligieres material and frames the Doctor with it. Now, the Consligiere's visit is hidden from the spy, since the Doctor is framed as the Consligiere.

Why? | Framers are much more discreet this way. Even if there is a spy- which combats heavily against framers, the framers can twist mafia visits and hide their own visit, which allows them to frame without worrying for the spy. What if town knew there was definitely a consort in the game? You can trick investigator results with the materials of your fellow consort, onto another player. That player would appear as escort/consort/transporter. I feel that this change definitely adds more realism.


Forger
Change 1 | Click the Sun Button to access 2 additional wills. The sun button is still accessible at night.
Change 1: Explanation | The additional wills can be written in during the day or night. At night, you can select a target and choose which will you want to use. Lets say you wrote down three different will types- one for sheriff, one for medium, and one for jailor. You can select which one you want to use for your forged target.
Change 2 | Gather a player's will at night. You will immediately get their will the moment you click the button to gather the will. You have 3 of these.

Why? | Forgers typically leave blank or write random words in forged wills because... you have less than 30 seconds to write everything down. ( And if mafioso/godfather picks the target slowly, even less time. ) Change 2 makes forging easier. Tracking down wills and replicating them is extremely difficult.


Disguiser
Change 1 | You can be revived by a retributionist.
Change 2 | Disguises last forever.

Why? | Disguisers are supposed to fool the town that they are a townie, And if successfully doing so, they could waste a retributionist's revive and regain one mafia member. With this change, reviving won't fully confirm revived targets, and disguisers could lie about the mediums. It would also be entertaining to do this :p and it would probably encourage more disguisers to act better as a townie. And change 2 allows disguisers to keep a consistent claim.


Godfather
Change 1 | You know if a mafia member was visited by a Sheriff, Investigator, or Spy.
Change 1: Explanation | The Godfather can see what role visited the mafia members. For an example, if a Sheriff visits the Janitor, the Godfather will receive a notification that the Janitor was visited by a Sheriff.

Why? | This adds more fun, realism, and strategy to the Godfather role. For the realism side, the Godfather should negotiate with the investigative players to quickly dismiss any evidence that can be potentially detrimental to the mafia. For an example, the Godfather could quickly act as a spy and say that a Framer visited a Forger if he sees that a Sheriff visited them- so they don't appear as suspicious.



All Mafia Support and Mafia Deception
Change 1 | Choose to kill someone instead of doing your regular ability.
Change 1: Explanation | Consligieres, Janitors, etc. can ignore their regular ability and choose to kill someone instead.
Change 2 | The Godfather cannot attack unless the other mafia members cannot attack.
Change 2: Explanation | The Godfather cannot attack unless the mafia member that was attacking was roleblocked (in that case, the Godfather may attack for them), all mafia members are dead besides the Godfather, or one of the mafia members is jailed and the only mafia left is the Godfather.

Why? | Most people hate being mafioso. You can clearly see by how many mafioso suicide. As a mafioso, there isn't much to do. If this change were to happen, mafioso should be removed from the role list (at least in ranked). The reason for Change 2 is because three mafia support/deception can be pretty overpowered. You could have three framers, or three blackmailers. With Change 2 and 3, it won't be overpowered as one of the mafia support or deception must attack. This also lets roles such as blackmailer or forger (who typically don't use their ability in the first nights) become good use.



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NEUTRALS

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Werewolf
Change 1 | Before the game begins, you can pick any town role to play as during the odd nights (cannot pick a Unique Role).
Change 2 | On odd nights, you will appear as your town role and you can use your town role ability. On even nights, you cannot use your town role ability; you can only attack as a werewolf.
Change 3: Explanation | Lets say, on odd nights you are a doctor. On odd nights you can heal, you appear innocent to sheriff, and doctor/disguiser/serial killer to investigators. On even nights, you become a werewolf, you appear suspicious to sheriff, and sheriff/executioner/werewolf to investigators. No, you can't win with town on odd nights.
Change 4 (undecided) | Werewolves that die on odd nights will appear as their town role.

Why? | This would be one of my favorite roles, and currently it's at one of my least favorite roles, mostly due to their difficulty. Not only would this tremendously increase werewolf winrates (which is good because currently it is extremely low), it allows the werewolf to create intelligent strategies, it makes the town investigatives question their results from odd nights, and it makes all townies question the supposedly confirmed ones. It gives the Werewolf more realism too. They're supposed to be regular people on regular nights and werewolves on full moons. And you know, Town of Salem townies don't do nothing.




Serial Killer
Change 1 | You are equipped with an extra blade that allows you to throw it at any player during the day, without revealing the knife's origin.
Change 1: Explanation | The blade will kill player on the spot, doing the death scene (where the roles and wills are revealed). This ability does not work on targets with basic defense. You can use this ability once.

Why? | What if you need someone dead... ASAP. Because they might perform or speak something potentially dangerous. You can use your handy blade to kill anyone, and unless they have a defense, your kill is safe and guaranteed because the doctors, bodyguard, or lookout can't be on them during the day. This also forces Jailor to go into hiding... who is the Serial Killer's worst enemy. If the Jailor jails the Serial Killer, Jailor is likely to have TP or LO on them, or write who is jailed in their will, which fully confirms the Serial Killer. Now the Jailor must go into hiding... because if they ask for TP LO, Jailor should expect the Serial Killer to swing a knife at them during the day. Because Jailor won't have tp lo (unless they discover that there is no serial killer) Jailor is more prone to death, making jailed Serial Killers appear somewhat more innocent.


Arsonist
Change 1 | If you are roleblocked, you douse your roleblocker.
Change 2 | You can hold up to 3 bottles of gas.
Change 3 | You regenerate 1 bottle of gas each night.
Change 4 | You can use 0 to 3 bottles of gas in a night.
Change 4: Explanation | For an example, you can douse player 1, 2, and 3, all in the same night by using 3 bottles of gas.

Why? | The Arsonist's main problem is having their doused targets die. This change will help solve this problem because early douses is likely to end up useless as opposed to dousing the same amount later because: you can predict who won't die and your douses is more likely to be on a living player (e.g. arsonist douses player 1, 2, and 3 over the course of 3 nights, but player 2 died. Instead, arsonist douses player 1, 3, 4 on night 3. Player 2 died so he can't douse player 2.


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Last edited by Rivelle on Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:26 am, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: Mafia and NK changes

Postby Rivelle » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:33 pm

The spoiler button and size changes won't work, ahaha now it looks ugly
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Re: Mafia and NK changes

Postby DragonClaw66 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:54 pm

Framer Change #1: I'm totally for changing specific investigation results as long as the Framer is able to deceive all of the other Town Investigatives as well. It shouldn't rely on just the Sheriff and Investigator.
Framer Change #2: I'd prefer a complete removal/rework of the Spy.
Framer Change #3: Passive framing, in my opinion, shouldn't be in the game. Look at the link in my signature; it explains how I think the Framer should be able to trick all the investigative roles.

Forger Change #1: I think that one extra will for forging is perfectly fine; adding three seems unnecessary.

Disguiser Change #1: The Disguiser needs to be reworked again (or get changed some other way). It's ability focuses on deceiving the Town through death and an minority faction should not have its members be okay with dying.

Godfather Change #1: More utility for the Godfather so that Tactical Mafia doesn't take away its purpose? All for it.

Mafia Support/Mafia Deception Change #1: This is Tactical Mafia, which I am a supporter of.
Mafia Support/Mafia Deception Change #2: Tactical Mafia has a limit of one attack per night, so this makes sense.
Mafia Support/Mafia Deception Change #3: Why...? Changing a player into a Mafioso when they could already kill defeats the purpose of allowing the option to use their unique ability or perform the attack.

Werewolf Change #1: I don't really like RNG, nobody here does. Random assignment works for a role like the Executioner, but not so much for the Werewolf you're proposing as it will become a part of its main ability.
Werewolf Change #2: They should be informed from the beginning so they can begin preparation.
Werewolf Change #3: I thought that was implied by the first change. I want to say that if these changes are applied to the Werewolf, it should become Neutral Chaos, not killing. Rampage itself is already a very chaotic mechanic, and I think that alone should make it Neutral Chaos, but adding the random Town role really pushes it in that direction.
Werewolf Change #4: No opinion.

Serial Killer Change #1: Unsure if this would be too powerful or not. I'd prefer a night ability that activates once a certain number of players is killed or once the Serial Killer has made it to the final X amount of players remaining.

Arsonist Change #1: Fair.
Arsonist Change #2: Agreed.
Arsonist Change #3: Absolutely.
Arsonist Change #4: Ye.
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Re: Mafia and NK changes

Postby Rivelle » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:03 pm

@DragonClaw66

Framer:
Ah I see, but I also don't like how in your idea the "focus" ability is only for lookout

Disguiser:
Change 1: I think Disguiser is fine, it just needs a buff. I don't think it's bad that Disguiser has to die to become useful. Disguisers have great potential; disguising as a sheriff could confirm mafia and townies and townies as mafia. Disguising as a spy could fake mafia visits and get the real spy lynched. Or disguising as a lookout could confirm the mafia as town and a townie as mafia. The problem is- many disguisers don't know how to play it properly.

Werewolf:
Change 1: Ah okay, perhaps the player could choose role they want to play as on day 1?
Change 2: I see, I only suggested that because I thought it'd be a little exciting

Serial Killer:
I don't think it would be overpowered. Serial Killers often lose already.

Anyway thanks for your feedback!
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Re: Mafia and NK changes

Postby Brilliand » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:20 pm

I like the Serial Killer day attack ability. It's similar to the ability to deal an Unstoppable, TP-ignoring attack once per game, which I've seen suggested before.

The difference is the day version requires adding a new game mechanic to ToS. I have my doubts that the devs will be willing to implement daykills, and if they do, it will likely cause some major meta changes to cope with being killed mid-discussion.
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Re: Mafia and NK changes

Postby StewieFellows » Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:55 am

I'm curious what a day kill as SK would even look like in game. Will they need to add an animation of the player getting the knife to hit them, and fall down as the music pauses and the death music comes in? That would be the biggest change to the day phase ever since the game's release.

Also, I know TOS doesn't always make sense, but how would the town not see SK use the knife when they're all facing each other talking? lol
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