Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

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Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby SilverCruz » Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:17 pm

Obviously, dead players quitting feels and often is extremely detrimental to the Medium. I don't believe that trying to stop people from quitting is a valid solution because you can't do that without catching people who have nothing constructive to add (their Will says it all or they were a Witch or something who has no reason to care about the game's turn-out after they're out), I believe that quit-proofing the game as much as possible so that it can keep going when someone does quit is the real answer.

Thus, for Medium, my proposal is to give them a new night ability. At night, they can choose to visit a dead player. If the visit succeeds, they will receive that player's History, which is effectively an auto-generated Last Will that summarizes the actions they took each night and the results of those actions. For example...

Day 3 - John Proctor was killed last night. We could not find a Last Will. His role was Investigator.

Night 3 - The Medium visits John Proctor successfully. He receives his History, which can be reviewed at any time after the visit.

The text of John Proctor's History may say something to this effect depending on how flowery/in-character you wanna be (maybe have a game option for In-character Histories and Concise Histories). Bolded text would be highlighted white or a relevant color in game.

---

In my life I was John Proctor, an Investigator.

On the first night, I investigated William Phips and deduced that they must be a Bodyguard, Godfather, or Arsonist.

On the second night, the night of my death, I attempted to investigate Ann Putnam but was distracted and unable to do so.

---

And, for reference, the Concise History might read something like this.

---

John Proctor - Investigator

Night 1 - William Phips. Bodyguard/Godfather/Arsonist.
Night 2 - Ann Putnam. I was roleblocked.

---

So the Medium gets the information regardless of whether or not John Proctor has quit, so that if he did quit that's as close to irrelevant as possible (though it could still be a detriment if there were multiple quits that night). This can also be used to discover cleaned and forged roles (as this is possible if the cleaned/forged player doesn't quit), though if the target's true role is Mafia or Neutral (or Coven, I guess, I don't have that expansion), the Medium will be told "You were not able to receive this spirit's History.". Note that this message is completely generic, and will also be shown if the Medium chooses a town role and then get stopped from completing the visit by a Witch, Escort, Consort, or whatever else if anything. (If necessary, have it completely override other messages so that it's opaque as to what actually happened. Careful now, Hypnotists)

I think that'd help because it'd give the Medium something constructive to do even if everyone quits, and as a buff I don't think it'd break Medium much if at all, since it's presently kind of an underwhelming role to handle and this ability would not matter at all in a game where nobody quits.
I know what I'm doing, generally, but I have no grace at all when things start to spin out of control.

I'd like to address the latter part, but I wouldn't know the first thing about that.
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby Kuter » Fri Apr 02, 2021 11:04 am

I like that. Just gotta see if they can make it happen
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby significantfox » Sat Apr 03, 2021 4:37 am

Would the medium only be able to visit town members, or also the dead mafia?
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby Quartzified » Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:49 am

significantfox wrote:Would the medium only be able to visit town members, or also the dead mafia?

If we were to continue to allow medium to talk to the dead, I would say only town members.

If medium would no longer be allowed to talk to the dead, I would say all dead players.
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby SilverCruz » Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:56 pm

significantfox wrote:Would the medium only be able to visit town members, or also the dead mafia?


They can attempt to visit anyone, but true Mafia and Neutral will give an opaque "You were not able to receive this spirit's history." message which is also shown if you're roleblocked or controlled or whatever while trying to visit a townie (again, it possibly blots out every other message short of "You have died!" so that exactly why the visit failed is not clear, but that's open to discussion), and no History will be given. The main reason for this is the Forger. Let's say for example Quitty McGee quits Day 1. The Forger decides "Oh boy! I've always wanted to try this!" and forges Quitty McGee as being the Godfather (or an Executioner or something if the Mafia has Quitbots). Town completely ignores the Spy saying that the Mafia visited Quitty McGee (or there is no Spy in the first place) and buys that at face value because Godfathers Day 1 quit all the time, but nobody else died and quit that night, so the Medium decides to check Quitty McGee anyway since they have nothing better to do, only to discover that Quitty McGee was actually a Vigilante the whole time! The Janitor is also the secondary reason, since Mediums should be able to check cleaned players (since if they don't quit they can just say "Yo, Medium, I'm a Sheriff." or something), but not get the information that they were Neutral or Mafia for free by there not being an option to check them at all.

Also, it would maybe be appropriate that if you check another Medium, you get access to every History they had collected before they went down since, again, this is information they can just tell you if they don't quit. As for why you can't receive Mafia/Neutral Histories, they simply can't be bothered to tell you because what good would that do them? A dead Mafia who doesn't quit doesn't benefit from feeding the Medium accurate information in most cases, so the Medium shouldn't have access to anything they couldn't reasonably expect a dead player to tell them. The only exception I could think of is if a Consigliere found a Neutral Killing, but even in that case the History would probably expunge any information that isn't directly related to who the Neutral Killing is since the Consigliere does not benefit from the Medium having a reasonably accurate idea of who the other townies are, and even then it'd probably be best to give them a switch that allows them to not let the Medium take that info off of them anyway which persists even if they quit. Whether it's on or off by default would be open to discussion, though, nevermind that it'd be completely irrelevant to the current Ranked role list (I'd probably say on by default so that it's consistent with the behaviour of other Mafia roles).

I'm building this idea off the question of "What information could a Medium reasonably expect to get from a player who didn't quit?". If a town player isn't being obtuse, then they always benefit from telling the Medium everything they know. Neutral doesn't benefit from the Medium knowing anything, and Mafia would usually consider the Medium knowing anything to be an active detriment. So that's where this is coming from.
I know what I'm doing, generally, but I have no grace at all when things start to spin out of control.

I'd like to address the latter part, but I wouldn't know the first thing about that.
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby SilverCruz » Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:05 pm

Medium still NEEDS this.
I know what I'm doing, generally, but I have no grace at all when things start to spin out of control.

I'd like to address the latter part, but I wouldn't know the first thing about that.
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby Midio7 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:22 pm

I really like this idea.
Just a guy who plays Town Of Salem daily
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Re: Medium Overhaul (Quitproofing)

Postby SilverCruz » Wed Apr 14, 2021 3:55 pm

Also, now that I think of it, it'd maybe actually be reasonable to throw Roleblock and Control Immunity onto the Medium if it got this on the grounds that the Medium can't get roleblocked or controlled out of talking to dead players (or even hearing them from jail), so by that same metric it'd be weird for them to be able to get roleblocked or controlled out of getting Histories since that's supposed to be a replacement for talking to dead players when they're not available to talk to.

Hmmh.
I know what I'm doing, generally, but I have no grace at all when things start to spin out of control.

I'd like to address the latter part, but I wouldn't know the first thing about that.
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