Bishop(Town Protective)

Suggest new roles or changes to current roles for the game here.

What changes should be made to this role?

The Bishop should have one charge of a self-protective ability.
3
33%
The sanctuary should heal poison.
1
11%
The Bishop should be a visiting role that has a rampage heal instead.
2
22%
The Bishop should have a unique notification.
2
22%
No changes need to be made. This role is balanced.
0
No votes
No changes can be made. This role cannot be balanced.
1
11%
Other
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 9

Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:23 pm

Bishop
Town Protective

Abilities
    Each night, you may choose to establish a sanctuary.
Attributes
    If you establish a sanctuary, you will grant anyone that visits you powerful defense.
    You may only establish 3 sanctuaries.

Hidden Attributes(Not listed on rolecard)
    Unique
    Indirect
Feedback
    [Bishop]: You may establish [X] more sanctuaries.
    [Bishop]: You have decided to establish a sanctuary tonight.
    [Bishop]: You established a sanctuary last night!
    [Player, if attacked]: You were attacked, but someone nursed you back to health!
Additional Information
    The Bishop does not protect themselves.


This role was inspired when I read this post today(2nd bullet point), in which Schweppes' PGO(Paranoid Gun Owner, Veteran) ability protected players instead of killing them. This gave me the idea of a reverse Veteran, in which instead of killing visitors, they protect them instead.

This role can be compared to Doctor, in which it may grant powerful defense to players. Unlike Doctor, however, they cannot choose who they protect. This is better than Doctor in the way that they can protect multiple players in one night, but worse than Doctor because the target would have to visit the Bishop, and thus sacrifice their night ability. Certain roles are also not able to be protected by the Bishop, such as Medium, Mayor, Jailor, or other nonvisiting roles.
Last edited by cob709 on Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:34 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby CapWarrior2 » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:30 pm

Is this role roleblock immune and does it 'heal' poison?
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:48 pm

CapWarrior2 wrote:Is this role roleblock immune and does it 'heal' poison?

It is not roleblock immune, which allows evil factions to stop them from protecting players.

I'm uncertain of whether it should heal poison, as I'm not a Coven player. Added to poll.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby CapWarrior2 » Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:46 am

cob709 wrote:
CapWarrior2 wrote:Is this role roleblock immune and does it 'heal' poison?

It is not roleblock immune, which allows evil factions to stop them from protecting players.

I'm uncertain of whether it should heal poison, as I'm not a Coven player. Added to poll.


Well I'm not sure 100%, mainly because I haven't played a game, let alone coven in ages, if for example, a crusader is on a poisoned target that is about to die and saves the target because of the powerful defence it provides. But Imo it shouldn't heal (remove poison) considering this gives doctor more of a unique attribute and doesn't make Poisoner completely useless.

But the role is definently a unique idea that could very well work.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby syjfwbaobfwl » Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:59 am

It doesnt seems very useful because in order to get protected, ppl have to waste their night action

Using it on alerting vet would mean that vet becomes a citizen

The only time when it works is when TP is chain protecting
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby alex1234321 » Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:09 am

I'm not sold on the idea of limited use TPs, but I don't see anything particularly wrong with them beyond the fact that limited use abilities tend to impact the game one way or the other far more than other abilities.

The biggest problem that I see with this role is the ability for metas to develop. If the Bishop somehow semi-confirms itself, it can tell all Town members to visit it, and often prevent a death for the night, especially if there is a TP alive to protect the Bishop itself. Limited uses can help, but this can be super powerful in the endgame but weak earlier on.

Maybe you can allow it to heal the visitors of a different target each night and give it a single use ability to heal its own visitors. That would require the Bishop to save its self-target ability until the endgame if it wants to do the strategy that I mentioned before.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:18 pm

syjfwbaobfwl wrote:It doesnt seems very useful because in order to get protected, ppl have to waste their night action

Using it on alerting vet would mean that vet becomes a citizen

The only time when it works is when TP is chain protecting

As mentioned in the original post, it can protect multiple people in one night. This is compensated by the fact that they must target the Bishop. Although it may seem wasteful, it is much better to waste your night action than to die.

The Veteran cannot be protected by the Bishop, as the Veteran cannot visit the Bishop. Please reread the original post.

This role actually reduces the effectiveness of TP chains, as they are limited to only 3 sanctuaries.

alex1234321 wrote:I'm not sold on the idea of limited use TPs, but I don't see anything particularly wrong with them beyond the fact that limited use abilities tend to impact the game one way or the other far more than other abilities.

The biggest problem that I see with this role is the ability for metas to develop. If the Bishop somehow semi-confirms itself, it can tell all Town members to visit it, and often prevent a death for the night, especially if there is a TP alive to protect the Bishop itself. Limited uses can help, but this can be super powerful in the endgame but weak earlier on.

Maybe you can allow it to heal the visitors of a different target each night and give it a single use ability to heal its own visitors. That would require the Bishop to save its self-target ability until the endgame if it wants to do the strategy that I mentioned before.


The Bishop cannot confirm itself because of the possibility that the Mafia could claim Bishop and choose to not attack. There are also some Town players that cannot visit the Bishop, which reduces the effectiveness of such a self-confirming strategy. If another TP protects the Bishop, then the Mafia has the opportunity to attack other roles. The role's power is limited throughout the game, including the endgame, as it requires players to sacrifice their night action.

I've considered making it into a rampaging heal, but it feels too awkward, as it would not protect itself nor its original target. Rather, it protects visitors of the target. Though, I will add it to the poll.

Edit: Changing the poll ended up resetting all the votes. everyone may revote
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby Blackwolfe99 » Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:08 am

CapWarrior2 wrote:
cob709 wrote:
CapWarrior2 wrote:Is this role roleblock immune and does it 'heal' poison?

It is not roleblock immune, which allows evil factions to stop them from protecting players.

I'm uncertain of whether it should heal poison, as I'm not a Coven player. Added to poll.


Well I'm not sure 100%, mainly because I haven't played a game, let alone coven in ages, if for example, a crusader is on a poisoned target that is about to die and saves the target because of the powerful defence it provides. But Imo it shouldn't heal (remove poison) considering this gives doctor more of a unique attribute and doesn't make Poisoner completely useless.

But the role is definently a unique idea that could very well work.

Doctor and GA are the only roles who can heal an already placed poison at this point. I think that may be changed with the header of the last update note, and the silhouette of a witch in the graphic.

Anyway, this role could be a fun and interesting role, but it has a problem: it has no control over who it protects, and TPs should not have that issue.
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EvilPudding wrote:Interesting idea and it is balanced like the WW

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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:26 pm

Blackwolfe99 wrote:
CapWarrior2 wrote:
cob709 wrote:
CapWarrior2 wrote:Is this role roleblock immune and does it 'heal' poison?

It is not roleblock immune, which allows evil factions to stop them from protecting players.

I'm uncertain of whether it should heal poison, as I'm not a Coven player. Added to poll.


Well I'm not sure 100%, mainly because I haven't played a game, let alone coven in ages, if for example, a crusader is on a poisoned target that is about to die and saves the target because of the powerful defence it provides. But Imo it shouldn't heal (remove poison) considering this gives doctor more of a unique attribute and doesn't make Poisoner completely useless.

But the role is definently a unique idea that could very well work.

Doctor and GA are the only roles who can heal an already placed poison at this point. I think that may be changed with the header of the last update note, and the silhouette of a witch in the graphic.

Anyway, this role could be a fun and interesting role, but it has a problem: it has no control over who it protects, and TPs should not have that issue.

That is an intentional design. In exchange for being able to protect multiple players, they don't get to choose the players that are protected. Similar to the Veteran, in which they don't decide who it attacks.
Last edited by cob709 on Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby Ezradekezra » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:30 pm

I'm not sure that I like the protection notification being the same as the Doctor's when every other protective role has a unique notification
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:34 pm

Ezradekezra wrote:I'm not sure that I like the protection notification being the same as the Doctor's when every other protective role has a unique notification

It may be too confirming to receive a unique notification, as they would know that their target is the Bishop. However, this would only apply if they are attacked.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby Ezradekezra » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:56 pm

cob709 wrote:
Ezradekezra wrote:I'm not sure that I like the protection notification being the same as the Doctor's when every other protective role has a unique notification

It may be too confirming to receive a unique notification, as they would know that their target is the Bishop. However, this would only apply if they are attacked.
Suggestion added to the poll.

(Poll before reset)
Spoiler: Image

Let the bishop establish a sanctuary at anyone's house instead of just their own then
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby alex1234321 » Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:49 pm

Ezradekezra wrote:I'm not sure that I like the protection notification being the same as the Doctor's when every other protective role has a unique notification


What do the differentiated notifications add to the game beyond confirmability? Especially for a role like this where a confirmed Bishop would be absolutely OP compared to an unconfirmed one even if it became a visiting role.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby rakso98 » Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:37 am

Interesting idea, with some quirky mechanics.

Mafioso about to get shot by vigilante? Just kill the Bishop and get healed by their sanctuary :P

Maybe the Bishop should have a self vest to counter this sort of strategy.

I disagree with rampage heal, sounds OP (you could just rampage heal jailor/mayor and all the TPs and spies on them etc...)

TBH I don't think adding this role would be good. It's interesting, but the usefulness of this role seems quite swingy/situational (ranging from useless to OP). I think it would just end up being used as a TPLO meta where half the town visits the Bishop on N1 and it's almost impossible for evils to get a kill. And it doesn't sound that fun to play.
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Re: Bishop(Town Protective)

Postby cob709 » Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:34 am

rakso98 wrote:Interesting idea, with some quirky mechanics.

Mafioso about to get shot by vigilante? Just kill the Bishop and get healed by their sanctuary :P

Maybe the Bishop should have a self vest to counter this sort of strategy.

I disagree with rampage heal, sounds OP (you could just rampage heal jailor/mayor and all the TPs and spies on them etc...)

TBH I don't think adding this role would be good. It's interesting, but the usefulness of this role seems quite swingy/situational (ranging from useless to OP). I think it would just end up being used as a TPLO meta where half the town visits the Bishop on N1 and it's almost impossible for evils to get a kill. And it doesn't sound that fun to play.

The Bishop would only heal the Mafioso if they choose to use a sanctuary.

If the Bishop gets a self-protective ability, should it still be able to establish a sanctuary?

The proposed rampage heal excludes itself and its target. It would be awkward to implement and weird to word.

if all protective roles visit the Bishop, then that leaves other players vulnerable to being attacked. It won't be impossible for evils to get a kill, as the Bishop can only protect players that visit it, meaning it cannot protect non-visiting roles. The playstyle would be focused around coordinating with the Town during the day to plan their action at night, while trying to prevent the Mafia from interfering.
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