Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

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Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Rickdaily12 » Sun May 12, 2019 4:42 pm

See thread title.

Instead of having to labour ourselves to make more Hydra games to satisfy the desires of the base, would it not be more worthwhile to instead stipulate in each game thread whether hydra slots are prohibited or enforced? Base line would be if not mentioned, people could join as a Hydra whenever they see fit.

Thoughts?

My understanding is that this is already standard for places like MS.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Chemist1422 » Sun May 12, 2019 4:45 pm

Meh, some people don't like playing with hydras because it makes the slot more difficult to read. I'd be in support of running games with hydras allowed but not required, but not in full support of hydras being allowed in every game.

Unless I'm misunderstanding and we're supporting the same thing here, which is a lolme.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Rickdaily12 » Sun May 12, 2019 4:48 pm

Chemist1422 wrote:Meh, some people don't like playing with hydras because it makes the slot more difficult to read. I'd be in support of running games with hydras allowed but not required, but not in full support of hydras being allowed in every game.

Unless I'm misunderstanding and we're supporting the same thing here, which is a lolme.

Hosts are free to ban hydras from a particular game by just saying so is what I'm proposing.

Otherwise the door to joining as a hydra should be permitted.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ejjinami » Sun May 12, 2019 4:50 pm

I absolutely support it.
It should be up to the host if they want to allow hydras to join, how many, how many heads, etc
but the idea is great imo

and I don't think hydras are always more difficult to read...
Sometimes they are, but I found that usually, I end up getting decent reads on hydra slots before on the majority of the player list...
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby leeten » Sun May 12, 2019 4:54 pm

But you can't share accounts on this site
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Rickdaily12 » Sun May 12, 2019 4:56 pm

leeten wrote:But you can't share accounts on this site

This is the forum policy. We can't break this.

I'm suggesting allowing, in signups, "I, Rickdaily12, join this game with ejjinami as my Hydra partner", where we post as separate entities but share the same slot in the game.

If we each use separate accounts, this wouldn't violate our policy.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby 0verki11 » Sun May 12, 2019 7:47 pm

im absolutly fine with this, would probably convince me to play more, having in place rules on number of heads is dumb, the host can decide how many they would allow if they allow hydras at all.
Id probably stop them from joining NFM and episodes though.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Eragon1329 » Sun May 12, 2019 7:59 pm

YES

YES

YES

YES

it will be a bit confusing

but sooo good
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby GrumpyGoomba » Sun May 12, 2019 10:59 pm

Wait what is a hydra?
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Rickdaily12 » Mon May 13, 2019 12:22 am

GrumpyGoomba wrote:Wait what is a hydra?

Multiple people sharing the same player slot in a game.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Google » Mon May 13, 2019 1:00 am

thanks for reminding me, rick.




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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Mon May 13, 2019 4:56 am

terrible idea will elaborate later
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby leyva45 » Mon May 13, 2019 9:25 am

I could see this working for most VFMs for sure. Not so sure about regular episodic games, and it will/should be up to the host with SFMs.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby leyva45 » Mon May 13, 2019 9:27 am

leyva45 wrote:I could see this working for most VFMs for sure. Not so sure about regular episodic games, and it will/should be up to the host with SFMs.

Most MS games have different slots too, and they would line up with VFM the best imo. Hydras are rare in 20+ player games.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Google » Mon May 13, 2019 9:45 am

ICECLIMBERS wrote:terrible idea will elaborate later

rick fucked me over, will elaborate later




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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Mon May 13, 2019 3:36 pm

"Terrible" is an overstatement, but I don't think it's a good idea. I don't know what MU's hydra policy is but I know on MS it's restricted from normal games. I guess to us standards would be "normal" even though MS normal is basically a closed VFM. Hydras are really strong- two heads really are better than one- and that can impact the game in an unhealthy way. You basically have two separate accounts capable of doubleteaming somebody, or collaborating together, which is why on other sites hydras are usually saved for themed larges (like our SFMs). VFMs are meant to be balanced so I'm opposed to it there. Standards I'm also not keen on it since they're supposed to be... standard.
As for SFMs I guess you could do it but then player amount comes in. Signups aren't as slow as they were in 2018 at least.
I think this would be best suited for TFMs at the host's discretion.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Google » Mon May 13, 2019 3:38 pm

ICECLIMBERS wrote:"Terrible" is an overstatement, but I don't think it's a good idea. I don't know what MU's hydra policy is but I know on MS it's restricted from normal games. I guess to us standards would be "normal" even though MS normal is basically a closed VFM. Hydras are really strong- two heads really are better than one- and that can impact the game in an unhealthy way. You basically have two separate accounts capable of doubleteaming somebody, or collaborating together, which is why on other sites hydras are usually saved for themed larges (like our SFMs). VFMs are meant to be balanced so I'm opposed to it there. Standards I'm also not keen on it since they're supposed to be... standard.
As for SFMs I guess you could do it but then player amount comes in. Signups aren't as slow as they were in 2018 at least.
I think this would be best suited for TFMs at the host's discretion.

all any was a standard.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Rickdaily12 » Mon May 13, 2019 6:18 pm

ICECLIMBERS wrote:"Terrible" is an overstatement, but I don't think it's a good idea. I don't know what MU's hydra policy is but I know on MS it's restricted from normal games. I guess to us standards would be "normal" even though MS normal is basically a closed VFM. Hydras are really strong- two heads really are better than one- and that can impact the game in an unhealthy way. You basically have two separate accounts capable of doubleteaming somebody, or collaborating together, which is why on other sites hydras are usually saved for themed larges (like our SFMs). VFMs are meant to be balanced so I'm opposed to it there. Standards I'm also not keen on it since they're supposed to be... standard.
As for SFMs I guess you could do it but then player amount comes in. Signups aren't as slow as they were in 2018 at least.
I think this would be best suited for TFMs at the host's discretion.

Do we even run TFMs anymore? Last I checked, this was a no.

Two heads are harder than one to fool, sure, but they're also easier to kill, and easier to catch in a slip. You might also catch them infighting on the thread, which could slip information to either team. Seems pretty double-edged in any truly balanced game to me, where players can be permitted to join either by themselves, or with another player in their spot.

Again, hosts banning them from their games at their discretion is fine to me, ICE, but I don't find your argument convincing as to why they need to be uniformly banned from all games whose required size is small enough where we could feasibly find the numbers for them to be ran.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Tue May 14, 2019 6:11 am

Never said uniformly banned just motnalowed in vanilla and standards that are to be taken seriously.
sfms feel free just know that your signups risk suffering if you have a lot of hydras from the double up and people who don’t want to play with a lot of hydras
“Hydras are easy to kill and slip” so that’s why Mets 8 person scum hydra was quicklynched d1
Tfms are small sfms


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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Google » Tue May 14, 2019 9:40 am

ICECLIMBERS wrote:Never said uniformly banned just motnalowed in vanilla and standards that are to be taken seriously.
sfms feel free just know that your signups risk suffering if you have a lot of hydras from the double up and people who don’t want to play with a lot of hydras
“Hydras are easy to kill and slip” so that’s why Mets 8 person scum hydra was quicklynched d1
Tfms are small sfms


“All any was a standard!!!!!1!!!1!!” is not a real argument

overexaggeration wins every time

if a game with 50:50 between mafia and town (not including neutrals) can happen in standard I assume alot can.




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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Tue May 14, 2019 10:22 am

it was a standard because most of the roles were standard-ish, there was an sfm at the time, and there’s precedent
otherwise past games like it (RAINBOW) have been sfms
would a bastard game be standard?
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby LOLingHyena » Wed May 15, 2019 12:40 am

Ignoring balance issues, I'd be in full support of this. I'd probably be able to play more games if I could hydra with people. Plus, it's super-fun collaborating with a partner who you know is the same alignment as you.

With that said, I kinda agree with ICE to a certain agree that hydras can be really strong, especially when I think of some potential pairings that are pretty powerful if they even just play for one day. @_@
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby Google » Wed May 15, 2019 1:23 am

LOLingHyena wrote:Ignoring balance issues, I'd be in full support of this. I'd probably be able to play more games if I could hydra with people. Plus, it's super-fun collaborating with a partner who you know is the same alignment as you.

With that said, I kinda agree with ICE to a certain agree that hydras can be really strong, especially when I think of some potential pairings that are pretty powerful if they even just play for one day. @_@

you always have me as your hydra partner.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby GrumpyGoomba » Wed May 15, 2019 1:31 am

Actually, even if this weren't unbanned, an SFM where all the slots were hydras would be fun I think. The hydra partners would be randomized similar to rolecards.
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Re: Thoughts on unbanning Hydras in our games?

Postby ICECLIMBERS » Wed May 15, 2019 5:28 am

Don’t randomize hydras or else you risk bad pairings. 7C was randomized and it was decided at the end that future games would be where you signup with somebody or alone to be randomized.
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