[Newcomer FM] NFM30 | Game Over [Town wins!]

[jakob12341]

Jakob, even if I'm janitor, that still means I'm not night immune.

Who said I had to believe James? After all I've seem so far from him..not much has been done by him to make us move in the right direction not even if he is vig...but I still don't like big risks.

I mean James could lie and he could be a neutral role it's possible. But keep in mind it was a theory...for now

[mihail66]

*ignores stupid mistake I made, which is probably going to look very scummy if anyone goes through my ISO*
So either James is a genius who succesfully scumread TopKek on 1-3, or James is getting all the PRs outed and killed. I think the second is true, from yesterday. We should not lynch TopKek, I stated yesterday that TopKek might be a PR who doesnt want to get out early. And considering that James wasnt controlled by the witch...
/vote James2

Off-topic now: I did the reads in google docs, thats the reason.

[RajolAttates]

/unvote

Unvoting, but keeping an eye on James.

Now that I think about it, it was pretty damn early to claim vig, which for me, is pretty solid ground for James's vig claim. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think scum would claim vig very early while knowing there's a witch/immune peeps out there.

Then again, this might be exactly what James wanted to hear.

Unvoting, but keeping an eye on James.

[lijik]

/unvote

Unvoting, but keeping an eye on James.

Now that I think about it, it was pretty damn early to claim vig, which for me, is pretty solid ground for James's vig claim. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think scum would claim vig very early while knowing there's a witch/immune peeps out there.

Then again, this might be exactly what James wanted to hear.

Unvoting, but keeping an eye on James.

He claimed to buy time. It was clear he could've gotten lynched if he didn't, so to avoid a lynch he claimed. It was to save himself.

[cmitc1]

you know what, I love being a medium in a game with a janitor, It makes me feel sooo powerful.
anyway,
I slept peacefully,

lets get to night result things.



went over some simple things with Silver. I asked for her thoughts on the reasons I am scumreading Topkek, and she agreed with me.

next, I started going over people with her, and after getting rid of all her nulls, and discussing it with her, this is her reads.

1. eeelneekey-town
2. TheForgot3n1-town
3. Schultz128-discussed a bit about how he pushed her, and how he pushed a bad lynch(at the time) (james) and she settled with a slight scum
4. lijik-town
5. RajolAttates-scummy (discussed a bit about how he sheeped her lynch)
6. RAmcius-town
7. riotheninja- she agreed with me when I told her there was decent effort in the reads, so she settled with- slight town.
8. TopkekeroniXX-scum (agrees with my points)
9. FrostyFox64....Var-Town, we liked how he was also pushing topkek
10. TazmanianBrit-town
11. NoodleLick-town
12. mihail66-townish
14. James-null (we debated about this, so it ended here o.o)
15. Tiltedcomedian-we found him to be slightly suspicious, his push on him just felt really off.-slightly scum
16. jakob12341-scummy (she said something about him pushing bad ideas or something, I will probably go over it)

so no comments on this? I thought people would discuss it a bit more.


(at school right now, so cant really comment on whats going on at the moment)

also, tomorrow, when i get have the role, should i out it asap, or should i keep it to myself if it dose not cc other claims.

[Varanus]

Not really much to say about those reads.

And I'm really not sure which scenario would call for you not sharing the role. Mafia sorta already know the cleaned role, so it's not like anything is being hidden from them.

[eeelneekey]

Not really much to say about those reads.

And I'm really not sure which scenario would call for you not sharing the role. Mafia sorta already know the cleaned role, so it's not like anything is being hidden from them.

^agreed. We should know immediately, no point hiding it. The reads, for me, mainly serve to help strengthen your claim.

/unvote

Unvoting, but keeping an eye on James.

What made you change your mind since this morning? James hasn't even been online much and those of us who have have mainly been discussing how he probably is guilty. Just intrigued.

[riotheninja]

Yeah, no reason to not share the role.

The reads match up with most reads written by others, and there's nothing extremely significant, so I don't think people have much to say.

If we do have an Escort, I think they should reveal, btw. There's already been a ton of PR claims.

[eeelneekey]

Ooh, just thought; if there's a dead chat, Taz, tell Ram what you found out last night so he can tell cmitc! (I'm assuming that's allowed, mods?

[TheForgot3n1]

Witch has 1 shot immunity to attack. So no, no he wasn't.

Escort, don't bother claiming to clear my name. I can handle these pitiful pushes on my own.

Forgotten, you're making one fatal miscalculation in your argument. You see, I'm not an idiot. There's not a chance in hell I would have claimed to be controlled under those circumstances.

Yes, Varanus, that's exactly why you can make this play.

The amount of benefits you get from making this move as mafia is immense. Assuming people swallow it, it's Witch knowing up to 2 mafia members (1 if you're the actual consort), and you becoming "confirmed town". It's a very, very good move from your side except that you have one fatal miscalculation. What if we don't swallow it.

You've literally outed yourself as mafia.

This conclusion of Varanus being scum hangs on two facts: whether there is an escort that would roleblock Noodle and whether Noodle's veteran and roleblock claim are true. I refuse to believe that mafia deliberately roleblocked the Veteran, since they couldn't possibly predict that Witch would control the consort and then make this fakeclaim play. So therefore, it HAS to be an Escort doing this roleblock OR Varanus being consort.

If you buy my premise, there are no other options. And any argument about Varanus being too smart to predict is all based on WIFOM. Btw look at my own earlier NFM game. I fakeclaimed transported day 2 as Witch (so there was 3 transported players). Why? For chaos and to signal to mafia that I'm the witch. No one understood the play and said "must be prankster, forgotten is probably town". The play this game has even more benefits for scum.

The reason I'm not voting Varanus is that I would prefer the SK to be hanged. And there's a much larger probability that James is the SK than Varanus.

[lijik]

Do you guys think the escort if there is one claim? Two people have answered, I want to hear others opinions. I personally wouldn't be opposed to it.

[Lexiam]

Current Vote Count

Player	Votes	Voters
	#	Votes Until Majority

Let me know if i missed any votes

[TheForgot3n1]

There are a few more things I want to say before voting.

FoS on Jakob and Schultz

Based on reads of them. Jakob, actually at end of Day1 as well, has acted really oddly. He's making weird conclusions and writing fluff in a way his townier self at start of Day1 wouldn't do. Jakob is faking town, and when it came to the end of Day1 with a lot of jumps between suspicions he started fluffing more and more. It isn't necessarily AI but it seems off. Basically referring to

I guess you make a point but I weren't in NFM28 and really don't feel like reading another game when this one is more important.

But I could say the same about cmitc because I've played a NFM with him before.

So I don't really know if that's an argument or anything.

And Schultz can sometimes be a bit aggressive in their posting.

But the question is.

Can we stay at 1 lynch?

This is too fluffy to make as town.

The stronger reads are the beginning of Day2 now...

Was just about to say the first part.

Anyway as for theories I have 1

So listen up

There's a chance that Top is lying about their claim if they happen to be with a Janitor or is the Janitor

why do I have a theory about this? They already used the Janitor night 1 I don't think they've got IC's on their team and also the Janitor can see the role of the person who got killed and cleaned.

Of course this would also mean 2 things:james is lying and is not with the mafia or town... but as the SK went for someone else or james is the witch.

my point is that they would get a free PR spot and perhaps be safe for the rest of the game.

And Ramcius role would be TP. (Don't know what though)

This gives me a reason to doubt Top. And their claim

This is such a scummy post. Earlier to this post you're talking about mafia compositions and stuff so much. You didn't comment varanus claim with a theory like you comment other stuff but instead you swallowed it instantly and want to move on. I can't get rid of this eerie feeling about Jakob.

The reason for suspecting Schultz is his change in both tone and demeanor since being pointed out as scummy. His aggressive style at the start is completely gone and you've now totally bought in James2 being Vigilante. It just seems.. fake. Either fake with the aggressiveness or fake with how you're calm and "normal" now. The transition wasn't genuine.

Schultz and Jakob being neutrals is more likely than Mafia I feel like... Might definitely be 1 Neutral in that pool.

Let me put a symbolic vote on Varanus, again I want to lynch SK if we can.

/vote Varanus

[eeelneekey]

Do you guys think the escort if there is one claim? Two people have answered, I want to hear others opinions. I personally wouldn't be opposed to it.

I think they should. All the other PRs are outed already anyway.

<snip>
The amount of benefits you get from making this move as mafia is immense. Assuming people swallow it, it's Witch knowing up to 2 mafia members (1 if you're the actual consort), and you becoming "confirmed town". It's a very, very good move from your side except that you have one fatal miscalculation. What if we don't swallow it.

You've literally outed yourself as mafia.

This conclusion of Varanus being scum hangs on two facts: whether there is an escort that would roleblock Noodle and whether Noodle's veteran and roleblock claim are true. I refuse to believe that mafia deliberately roleblocked the Veteran, since they couldn't possibly predict that Witch would control the consort and then make this fakeclaim play. So therefore, it HAS to be an Escort doing this roleblock OR Varanus being consort.
<snip>
The reason I'm not voting Varanus is that I would prefer the SK to be hanged. And there's a much larger probability that James is the SK than Varanus.

Yeah, this is basically what I said earlier; if no Escort comes forwards and confirms they RBd Noodle of their own volition then Varanus is either the Consort or claiming on behalf of them. There's a slim chance that both the Escort visited Noodle out of free will and Varanus as a Cit was witched to someone else, though, which is why I'd rather hang James today.

We know for sure that either James or Topkek is a barefaced liar. This is a fact. Varanus, we're not sure of yet. I say lynch James today and keep a FoS on Varanus.
/vote James2

[eeelneekey]

@Lex, you've got Noodle down as voting for both Topkek and James

[TheForgot3n1]

Yeah, this is basically what I said earlier; if no Escort comes forwards and confirms they RBd Noodle of their own volition then Varanus is either the Consort or claiming on behalf of them. There's a slim chance that both the Escort visited Noodle out of free will and Varanus as a Cit was witched to someone else, though, which is why I'd rather hang James today.

We know for sure that either James or Topkek is a barefaced liar. This is a fact. Varanus, we're not sure of yet. I say lynch James today and keep a FoS on Varanus.
/vote James2

Makes sense. Just symbolic vote as I said before. I want more info from James2 before voting.

Also I looked through Ramcius and Taz quickly. They didn't really say anything that was too unordinary. Ramcius said "it's either schultz, Lijik or silver" and that was about it on his read front. He was actually pretty accurate in his thoughts throughout day1, imo.

[Lexiam]

Current Vote Count

Player	Votes	Voters
	#	Votes Until Majority

Fixed

[lijik]

Ok I'm just going to go for it...
I'm the escort.

Why did I rb Noodle? I didn't know who was in the mafia and I didn't want to risk rbing a PR, so I figured I'd rb Noodle. Either they would be almost confirmed vet (as it turned out today), no one would die to the mafia, making them a huge suspect, or we wouldn't really get anything, but we also wouldn't lose any important role abilities other than a wasted rb. Rbs don't hurt veterans, so I went for it.

[TopkekeroniXX]

Well, so much for my theory.

This practically confirms Noodle, since if he were mafia, they wouldn't have expected him to be roleblocked so he would have done the kill or clean. Especially since the only maf role within the invest results is agent, which isn't tremendously useful at night.

[jakob12341]

There are a few more things I want to say before voting.

FoS on Jakob and Schultz

Based on reads of them. Jakob, actually at end of Day1 as well, has acted really oddly. He's making weird conclusions and writing fluff in a way his townier self at start of Day1 wouldn't do. Jakob is faking town, and when it came to the end of Day1 with a lot of jumps between suspicions he started fluffing more and more. It isn't necessarily AI but it seems off. Basically referring to

I guess you make a point but I weren't in NFM28 and really don't feel like reading another game when this one is more important.

But I could say the same about cmitc because I've played a NFM with him before.

So I don't really know if that's an argument or anything.

And Schultz can sometimes be a bit aggressive in their posting.

But the question is.

Can we stay at 1 lynch?

This is too fluffy to make as town.

The stronger reads are the beginning of Day2 now...

Was just about to say the first part.

Anyway as for theories I have 1

So listen up

There's a chance that Top is lying about their claim if they happen to be with a Janitor or is the Janitor

why do I have a theory about this? They already used the Janitor night 1 I don't think they've got IC's on their team and also the Janitor can see the role of the person who got killed and cleaned.

Of course this would also mean 2 things:james is lying and is not with the mafia or town... but as the SK went for someone else or james is the witch.

my point is that they would get a free PR spot and perhaps be safe for the rest of the game.

And Ramcius role would be TP. (Don't know what though)

This gives me a reason to doubt Top. And their claim

This is such a scummy post. Earlier to this post you're talking about mafia compositions and stuff so much. You didn't comment varanus claim with a theory like you comment other stuff but instead you swallowed it instantly and want to move on. I can't get rid of this eerie feeling about Jakob.

The reason for suspecting Schultz is his change in both tone and demeanor since being pointed out as scummy. His aggressive style at the start is completely gone and you've now totally bought in James2 being Vigilante. It just seems.. fake. Either fake with the aggressiveness or fake with how you're calm and "normal" now. The transition wasn't genuine.

Schultz and Jakob being neutrals is more likely than Mafia I feel like... Might definitely be 1 Neutral in that pool.

Let me put a symbolic vote on Varanus, again I want to lynch SK if we can.

/vote Varanus

Do I sense a bit of OMGUS?
It was a theory for the use of getting us some where and I didn't know what to say about his witched claim... I'm just trying to be less hostile towards Varanus as I've seen him as my worst enemy...but those were personal matters

I just wanted you guys to have a saying on something instead of me filling every single page :/ + it could've gotten bad if you asked me about Varanus because he's always kind of unreadable.

Just don't want another warning -_-

[jakob12341]

Well, so much for my theory.

This practically confirms Noodle, since if he were mafia, they wouldn't have expected him to be roleblocked so he would have done the kill or clean. Especially since the only maf role within the invest results is agent, which isn't tremendously useful at night.

Where do we place James then? Now there's more PR roles than there's supposed to be so scum gotta be hiding in there. Or am I mistaken?

[Varanus]

/vote Forgotten

You knew this was coming. You were deliberately trying to draw the escort into claiming. Great job, now the escort claimed.

[Varanus]

Dangit lijik, I told you I could take on these morons without you claiming.

[eeelneekey]

Ok I'm just going to go for it...
I'm the escort.

Why did I rb Noodle? I didn't know who was in the mafia and I didn't want to risk rbing a PR, so I figured I'd rb Noodle. Either they would be almost confirmed vet (as it turned out today), no one would die to the mafia, making them a huge suspect, or we wouldn't really get anything, but we also wouldn't lose any important role abilities other than a wasted rb. Rbs don't hurt veterans, so I went for it.

Okay, this makes sense to me! I did kinda figure that the Escort would want to avoid James and might just go for someone loud.

Rolelist:
Town Investigative - TazmanianBrit (Investigator)
Town Protective - Topkek (Doctor)
Town Killing - NoodleLick (Veteran)
Random Town - lijik (Escort)
Random Town - Cmitc (Medium)/James2 ("Vigilante")/Ramcius (Cleaned)
Citizen - SilverSpots
Citizen - Ramcius (Cleaned)
Citizen
Citizen
Citizen
Citizen
Citizen

Mafia Support (Consort, Consig, Agent)
Blackmailer
Janitor

Witch
Serial Killer

Based on this, I'm going to say that cmitic is Med, Ram was a Cit, and James is scum. Who wants to bet he'll come out saying he's a Cit again now? :')
Oh, and it also makes me trust Varanus a little more, as he's likely not a Consort and the Mafia kill/clean went off smoothly. He's not completely off the hook, mind you. Just statistically more likely he's Town now.

p-edit:

/vote Forgotten

You knew this was coming. You were deliberately trying to draw the escort into claiming. Great job, now the escort claimed.

Yeah, no, I don't see the sense in this vote. I also wanted the escort to claim, so did lijik themselves, are we both scum? The information gained from this claim by Town at this point outweighs the info gained by scum.
James is basically confirmed scum now, why not vote him?

[Varanus]

You wanted it more because you're a poor, confused player. Forgotten was undoubtedly baiting the claim, he actually knows better.

The only information you've gained is who the escort is. Nothing more. And scum benefits from that far more than anybody else.