[Newcomer FM] NFM1 | "Getting Schooled" (Town & Exe Wins!)

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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Rossendale » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:28 am

Are we using Mafia Tactical (aka. Mafia choose who kills)?
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Kmenx » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:28 am

First mafioso
Second is actually all of them are good
Third is obviously agent no whispers makes agent weak but not a trash bug still can be used
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Kmenx » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:29 am

Rossendale wrote:Are we using Mafia Tactical (aka. Mafia choose who kills)?

Tactical has to be in play there is a chance of mafioso not to be in the game
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby MamiT0m0e » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:32 am

If that is the worst.. then which one would do the killing would one role always be turned into mafioso by rng or would they take a vote who to kill in night chat of who to kill?


Worst roles or players because i don't know the players that much to make that decision...

If you are asking for the roles that it would be the worst for the mafia i would say:
mafioso, framer, disguiser
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Kmenx » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:33 am

MamiT0m0e wrote:If that is the worst.. then which one would do the killing would one role always be turned into mafioso by rng or would they take a vote who to kill in night chat of who to kill?


Worst roles or players because i don't know the players that much to make that decision...

If you are asking for the roles that it would be the worst for the mafia i would say:
mafioso, framer, disguiser


Disguiser is good this is not Tos :D
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Arcthurus » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:36 am

It's important to note Mafia Tactical is in play - any mafia member may carry the factional kill.
Also keep in mind that the Framer, Mafioso and Disguiser roles in FM aren't exactly like the ones used in ToS.
For all rolecards, see here.


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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby CJBlack44 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:38 am

Mafioso \ Consort \ Consig
Consigliere \ Framer \ Janitor
Agent \ Disguiser \ Consort

Consig is the worst role out there, if there is one we should get rid of them as soon as possible. Speaking of which, I have another question: are the Mafia roles unique? As in, if Consig rolls in slot 1, can it roll in slot 2 as well?

Worst case scenario would be : Consig, Janitor, Disguiser\Consort I think. Disguiser and Framer can possibly screw up our Town Invest and lead to a mislynch, so those pretty much suck. Consort can be worse than Disguiser or viceversa, depends on the situation. Consort has the advantage that it's fairly easier to confirm than Disguiser or Framer.

Best case scenario would be Mafioso, Framer, Agent. Agent is pretty much useless in a game with no whispers.

Either way, we must figure out the Mafia composition ASAP.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Kmenx » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:42 am

Agent can bug people to see who they visited last night that s the only use of agent so agent is a nerfed consig in this game
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby MamiT0m0e » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:44 am

Now how bout a worst case sinario for town roles?
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Rossendale » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:44 am

TheCow wrote:Alright, why do you guys think that those would be the worst Mafia members?


I think it's the worst combination because it gives mafia a whole lot of information whilst denying it to town. From what I understand, an FM game for Town and Mafia is a race - Town wants to get information before they lose the votes, Mafia want to get the votes (vote majority) before Town gets too much information. Well, more or less. The Janitor and Consigliere puts Mafia leagues ahead of the Town in terms of information, the Janitor can open up claims in the rolelist and cause confusion whilst the Consigliere paints a picture of the town for the Mafia. The Consort is also a strong Mafia role since it can deny Town information by blocking the Investigative, or it can stop the Protective from protecting people. That, and in a combo with a Janitor and Consig, the Consort has to come from group 3, which has Agent and Disguiser, both (as I understand) useful, but far weaker roles than Consort.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:50 am

Citizen medium would be worst for town, assuming no Janitor.

In any case, I agree with Consig being the worst. It would allow quick capture of our TPs. That aside, Consort is annoying because it directly blocks a TI reveal.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby CJBlack44 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:51 am

Worst case scenario for Town would be:

Town Investigative - Spy would be pretty much useless in this game, compared to Invest or Sheriff. I hope TI isn't a spy, that would suck.
Town Protective - Marshal? BG is better than Doc and Marshal but I'm not yet sure how effective a Marshal is compared to Doctor.
Random Town - Medium probs
Random Town - Citizen. DUH
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I really also hope there's no transporter. I hate transporters in ToS, they always mess shit up for everyone. I doubt it's much different in FM.

I also have yet another question (just want to make sure): can Random Town roll Town Power?

Also, still not sure whether or not Mafia roles are unique.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:52 am

Town Power can't role in this game.
The only unique Mafia roles are Mafioso and Mafia Head, the latter being restricted.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby MamiT0m0e » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:54 am

TheCow wrote:Citizen medium would be worst for town, assuming no Janitor.

In any case, I agree with Consig being the worst. It would allow quick capture of our TPs. That aside, Consort is annoying because it directly blocks a TI reveal.

I don't think that we have any Town Power Roles they are all Listed under unused... along with transporter

But i agree with Citizen,medium and I would say spy/lookout for invest (assuming spy can only plant bugs and not see who mafia invest)
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:57 am

Sorry, this gets confusing but when I said TP I meant Powered Town. TPw is typically how people refer to Town Power.

I'll call it PR from now on to avoid confusion.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:58 am

Spy may see who the Mafia visit each night. IMO invest is the weakest this setup.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Rossendale » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:02 am

I'm wondering, what interaction does framer have with jester? Does the framed target appear as Framer/Jester to the Invest?
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Rossendale » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:02 am

Rossendale wrote:I'm wondering, what interaction does framer have with framer? Does the framed target appear as Framer/Jester to the Invest?


fixed, rip
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:05 am

Rossendale wrote:
Rossendale wrote:I'm wondering, what interaction does framer have with framer? Does the framed target appear as Framer/Jester to the Invest?


fixed, rip

Framer can frame a player to be Mafia to the Sheriff and any role to the Invest, as per the role card.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby Rossendale » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:14 am

TheCow wrote:
Rossendale wrote:
Rossendale wrote:I'm wondering, what interaction does framer have with framer? Does the framed target appear as Framer/Jester to the Invest?


fixed, rip

Framer can frame a player to be Mafia to the Sheriff and any role to the Invest, as per the role card.


Oh, okay thanks. Anyway, I still think that the Consig/Janitor/Consort combo is the strongest one for Mafia.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby RhazhBash » Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:22 am

Greetings fellow nubs. I wish you all good luck, you're gonna need it.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:16 am

RhazhBash wrote:Greetings fellow nubs. I wish you all good luck, you're gonna need it.

What are your thoughts on the role list speculation?
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby alouvre » Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:31 am

S'up. Name's Alouvre. You call me Alou or whatever if the spelling's tough to remember.

Not too good at role speculation, but pretty much every role has the potential to be strong in this setup, I'd think. Sheriff is probably one of the best roles to have. Since nobody is investigative immune, getting an N/S on somebody will essentially confirm them as non-mafia. Which is nice.

Thoughts on mafia roles:

Spoiler: Janitor: Claimspots are one of the things mafia value most. PoE is pretty damn powerful, but we can't use it if there are cleaned targets.

Consort: Prevents PRs from outing themselves without getting roleblocked every night and can also prevent a valuable night of protection, investigation, etc.

Consigliere: Allows the mafia to get the rolelist far earlier. In conjunction with the janitor, it can allow the mafia to make more efficient kills.

Agent: Essentially a mafia tracker, meaning they can detect visiting PRs and function as sort of a weaker consigliere.

Framer: Can pretty much mess the fuck up out of sheriffs and investigators.

Mafioso: Getting rid of a mafioso will essentially roleblock one mafia role each night.

Disguiser: Harmful to investigators, but sheriffs are immune to them.

That's it, I think. Poke me if I missed something. I have to run now. See ya.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby TheCow » Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:41 am

I'm going to request protection tonight.
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Re: [Newcomer FM] NFM1 Day One (Simulation)

Postby CJBlack44 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:42 am

TheCow wrote:Spy may see who the Mafia visit each night. IMO invest is the weakest this setup.


That's true, but I still don't consider Spy to be as useful as invest. Mafia won't visit that many new people every night (that make it alive the following day), so the best Spy can do is point out one person per day that isn't Mafia. Two if they're lucky, but I doubt it. If there's consig and consort for example, there's a great chance that if X is checked and discovered to be important, consort will also block X the following night. Ugh, am I making any sense? A spy would be very useful in case of Framer, but otherwise I don't know what to say.

I don't think investigator is weak. If Mafia composition is discovered early, Invest can easily check who's Town and who's Mafia. Of course, if there's a Framer, Invest isn't the best option, considering Framer can pick which role Invest sees their target as (if I understood the rolecard correctly). I think I'm just biased cause Invest is one of my favorite roles :P

The best town invest would be Sheriff. While they can be fooled that a townie is Mafia, they can't be fooled that a Mafia is townie, which makes Sheriff by far the best option in this game. Here's hoping :D
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