FM7B | Tricks & Pranks Ensue | Town, Jester, Phantom Win!

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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:16 pm

We have two confirmed NKs. However, with the high likely hood of a prankster, it might become harder to discern what, exactly.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby SpellChecker » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:19 pm

As a Medium I simply compose everything in my will, I would immediately tell town who is detestable if investigator/sheriff or presumably a reliant town that I can trust, else I would just place it in my will.

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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:20 pm

TheCow wrote:We have two confirmed NKs. However, with the high likely hood of a prankster, it might become harder to discern what, exactly.


We almost certainly have a RT rolled Cit, to add onto this.

I think our worst fear is if a NK rolled Arsonist. That will be the hardest to tell. After that, probably SK if there's not a second kill.

Something else that I'm more worried about is proving whether a witch exists or not. That could be a nightmare if the prankster's any good, and could be especially devastating for Invests if they get that. I wonder if trying to lynch off the NE just to confirm it would be a worthy goal. Hm...

Also, something I want clarity on, Invenio. Does the prankster overwrite night results? Or does the person get that + the night results?

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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:23 pm

My guess is that the Prankster is going to use one shot of their ability N1, and then save it for bigger plays later. The attacked but healed and such will make TPro roles harder to discern, BG aside.

I'd be weary of big maf trans plays, like the one in CFM1A, except this time executed better, because of a prankster.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby SpellChecker » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:24 pm

FirelightKnight wrote:
SpellChecker wrote:As a Vigilante, I simply shoot arbitrarily in light of the fact that I feel exhausted. :lol:

I'm just going to point out politely (so no offense?) that that's not a good idea at all. If your judgement is flawed, or the target's play style just doesn't make sense to you, you're likely to shoot a townie. And since vigilantes shoot themselves after killing a townie (do they still do that in FM?), that's two dead townies that could have been prevented. You won't be wrong all the time, but I still say that's not really the best idea..


I never said it was a decent methodology in any case, yet that is exactly how I play, this wont be happening the FM anyway.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Invenio » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:24 pm

Cyantic wrote:Also, something I want clarity on, Invenio. Does the prankster overwrite night results? Or does the person get that + the night results?


From the rolecard:
For example, an investigator pranked into thinking he was roleblocked will still receive night results with clues as to which role his target was. However, he will not know for sure if he slept peacefully.

So say that investigator is transported and pranked to think he was witched. The night result would be: You were controlled by a witch! Your target is a blahblahblah.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby ADorkOfPork » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:24 pm

TheCow wrote:My guess is that the Prankster is going to use one shot of their ability N1, and then save it for bigger plays later. The attacked but healed and such will make TPro roles harder to discern, BG aside.

I'd be weary of big maf trans plays, like the one in CFM1A, except this time executed better, because of a prankster.


But, Prankster isn't confirmed :distracted
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:26 pm

ADorkOfPork wrote:
TheCow wrote:My guess is that the Prankster is going to use one shot of their ability N1, and then save it for bigger plays later. The attacked but healed and such will make TPro roles harder to discern, BG aside.

I'd be weary of big maf trans plays, like the one in CFM1A, except this time executed better, because of a prankster.


But, Prankster isn't confirmed :distracted

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There is a higher chance of there being one, so we should assume there is, until proven otherwise. Especially with a role this dangerous.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby MiniatureCowgirl » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:27 pm

/vote Invenio

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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby parkerparkour » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:27 pm

I accuse cow of being prankster
Cause dat ass is hilarious ;)

Wait that came out wrong

Hiya anyway guys, I'm going to have no idea what's going on but that's the usual
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:28 pm

SpellChecker wrote:As a Medium I simply compose everything in my will, I would immediately tell town who is detestable if investigator/sheriff or presumably a reliant town that I can trust, else I would just place it in my will.

Additionally presumably not, I simply chat even infrequently on day 1 on Town of salem game.


Alright. Here comes your warning.

Anything you say can be used in a case against you, just to make sure you are aware of that. You have the option of not replying still on the table, Spell, if you wish to take it.

With that out of the way...

How do you play Godfather? Mafioso? Framer? Consort? Consigliere?
How do you play Spy?
How do you play Serial Killer?
How do you play Arsonist?

---

Probably blow one use N1 or N2 for sure. I'm not quite sure if we'd see transport action since only one person can get that result. If we have a transporter already, it's especially risky, since they can trans to confirm two people, and Prankster can only trans one. I don't think that's the biggest danger of the prankster, but I'd be weary of one trans for sure.

I'm not necessarily as worried about Protective, as it's not like it's going to really throw us. It'll be an inconvenience at best for docs, and might cause some interesting night action confusion, but you have to remember - Mafia will want to kill, constantly. Serial Killers will want to kill constantly. We do have a random neutral which is possibly the biggest risk for this, but if it lands SK, the Prankster is pretty much rendered useless. And it's not like we're entirely clueless here either, by the time we have to start confirming, there'll be some dead neutrals to help clean up the rolelist.

Speaking of which, IF YOU ARE A NEUTRAL BENIGN, CLAIM TODAY. IF YOU CLAIM LATER ON, YOU WILL BE LOOKED AT WITH A LOT OF SUSPICION WHICH IS WHAT YOU DON'T WANT.

---

Invenio; Thanks. It wasn't entirely clear on the rolecard.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Invenio » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:29 pm

Vote Count:
Invenio (10): SirPiez, FireDarkKnight, Anime, k1llth35t0ry, iEsDeAtH, Gossling, Spellcheckr, Elephant, SwedishLime, MiniatureCatgirl
Nellyfox (1): Cyantickle
Give Me Donuts Tonight (1): ADorkOfPorkchops

20 players alive, 11 votes for majority.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:31 pm

Gossie wrote:
Cyantic wrote:
SpellChecker wrote:Speaking of which, IF YOU ARE A NEUTRAL BENIGN, CLAIM TODAY. IF YOU CLAIM LATER ON, YOU WILL BE LOOKED AT WITH A LOT OF SUSPICION WHICH IS WHAT YOU DON'T WANT.

Lol, I claimed survivor at the end of D2 during GFM, and nobody besides the jester voted for me for the entire game :lol:


That's not a necessarily smart play in FM.

See quite a few games in which the survivor claimer has been pressed beyond on belief or lynched. I strongly encourage survivors and survivor claimers to reveal today.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:35 pm

Gossie wrote:How is an FM game different from a CFM game though?


There's (at least from what I saw, I haven't really kept up) a slight skill difference. People who play CFM tend to be people who start and people who play FM tend to be players who play more regularly.

But in this case, nothing. In CFM 1B a Survivor got lynched for claiming... D2 I believe. He was my mafia member in possibly one of the weirdest plays I've seen. There's others if you want to look. It's much more advisable to have Survivor reveal so town can narrow down the rolelist a bit, don't you think so?
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Invenio » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:36 pm

Gossie wrote:How is an FM game different from a CFM game though?


FM [Forum Mafia] (non-episode)
Run by any Forum Mafia moderator. Must include clear-cut day and night phases, an un-informed majority (town-esque) versus an informed minority (mafia-esque), and lynches voted on by players during the day phase. Any rules not specified default to the standard game rules. Players may only be in one FM game (whether episode or non-episode) at a time. Named by the last episode number, followed by a letter incrementing (A, then B, etc.) by the start of every game.

CFM [Community Forum Mafia]
CFM games must be pitched to the CFM board and co-hosted by any Forum Mafia moderator. Must include clear-cut day and night phases, an un-informed majority (town-esque) versus an informed minority (mafia-esque), and lynches voted on by players during the day phase. Specific duties to each moderator should be worked out on a game-by-game basis. Players may only be in one CFM game at a time. Numbered by the start of the game by an incrementing number, one more than the last CFM number.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:38 pm

If Amne does not claim D1, they're going to be shot by the vig later on in the game when their role eventually comes out.

A Trans play would involve outing 2-3 members of the Mafia, which is why it is unlikely, but we just shouldn't take any tran's shit, real or not. Transporters, do not reveal. Prankster is capable of making some #lcsbigplays if the maf is willing to take big risks (such as not attacking for a night to "prove" a proc fakeclaim) and in these situations, we must view everything with a grain of salt. Reads and scum hunting will be quintessential, until we can confirm the prankster is either dead, or not in existence.

Prankster seems like it has two "styles" that one may use: harassment and risk/reward play.
To harass with it is to make night results seem unreliable, or to trick the town into thinking there are roles in play (like witch or arso, for example). If this is the case, it will make planned night phases more difficult, in that we might lose out on "proving" roles, through results (healing, RBing, etc.)
The other way is to make a big play, such as a trans play. As I said, we cannot even think about letting a big play slide. What I mean is that we must call every bluff, if such a situation arises.

If anyone starts to jest, they're going to be shot. End of story.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby parkerparkour » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:38 pm

Do people generally sign up for both CFM and FM games at once?

I honestly haven't looked
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:40 pm

Gossie wrote:How is an FM game different from a CFM game though?

Different game mechanics, more experimental role lists in CFM, those sorts of things. Last I checked, there are no zombies; no "Switzerland"; no anything of that kind, in this game: only the Prankster, and a relatively tough role list.

A quarter of this game is neutral.

@Parker: yes, people do.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby MiniatureCowgirl » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:41 pm

@ Parker: I've done it before
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby pretzellover33 » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:43 pm

FM is not ToS.

Survivors who take sides immediately are extremely stupid if they also reveal D1.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:45 pm

parkerparkour wrote:Do people generally sign up for both CFM and FM games at once?

I honestly haven't looked


Some do.

---

Amne and Survivors should be shot if they claim D2 or later, imo. If they were going to white knuckle it through D1, they can white knuckle it through the rest of the game. Only problem is we might not a vigilante or jailor to remove these guys.

Grand plans would probably involve less Trans and more Framer and Disguiser in this game, I'd think. Regardless, I'd be heavily suspicious of heavy handed claims that aren't handed straight from the town power role or TK reveal via deathnote. We're probably more in danger of harassment since it's the first time and that seems to be the easiest way to play. Although if you were well enough organized, you could possibly throw town for a loop.

Out of all of them, I think these are the least likely we'd see.

You were roleblocked!
You were scared off by a marshal!
You have successfully healed your target!
You were attacked but somebody fought off your attacker!
You were attacked but you are immune at night!
You were attacked but your vest saved you!
Your target is night immune!
You slept peacefully!

Quite a decent chunk. If their ability follows, and considering a good amount of these players will not have vests and will have night actions, and especially since Prankster is limited, it proves risky at best to use these. I could see them in some grand plan play, but others I doubt will happen. That doesn't mean not to look out for them.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:46 pm

FirelightKnight wrote:
Cyantic wrote:
Gossie wrote:How is an FM game different from a CFM game though?

It's much more advisable to have Survivor reveal so town can narrow down the rolelist a bit, don't you think so?

But what if the Survivor isn't siding with Town, and doesn't want to help the town in any way? Of course, that's really risky since without claiming the evil roles won't know you're Survivor anyway, and might kill you, but still.
I think it's an alright strategy, although a risky one, to not claim at all, if you time your vests right.

Also, in ToS at least, I've seen people killed for claiming Survivor day one simply because nobody wants the risk of them picking their enemy's team, or because they just don't like Survivors.

I'm not saying this because I don't want Survivor to reveal, I do think it'd be handy, but there are plenty of reasons that they might not. Just my two cents.

This isn't ToS. If a survivor wants to win, typically they reveal early so Town doesn't murder them. It has happened before where a survivor didn't claim at all, even until they died, and they got lynched because people thought they were a Bomber.

In any case, by not revealing, a survivor is essentially declaring themselves an enemy of the town, and so we, the town, have no choice but to shoot and/or lynch them. By not revealing, they almost definitely lose out on their chance of winning with Town, burning a bridge needlessly.

I agree with Cy, in regards to the Prankster uses, and how those are less likely. Again, big plays can happen, but not in a "normal" situation.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby TheCow » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:52 pm

Unrelated, but:

No one softclaim your role. Do not hard claim unless you have to. Investigative roles, avoid revealing, unless your're 100% you have a lead. Citizens, be active. Just because you don't have a night action doesn't mean you should lay back. Scum hunting will be key in this game, and everyone needs to play a part.

Because of agents, hardclaiming before the 24 hour mark is ill-advised.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Cyantic » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:56 pm

TheCow wrote:Unrelated, but:

No one softclaim your role. Do not hard claim unless you have to. Investigative roles, avoid revealing, unless your're 100% you have a lead. Citizens, be active. Just because you don't have a night action doesn't mean you should lay back. Scum hunting will be key in this game, and everyone needs to play a part.

Because of agents, hardclaiming before the 24 hour mark is ill-advised.


Seriously, do not softclaim. I will back Cow up on this. Soft claiming has screwed so many people in these games. Either fully come out if you have a good reason to do so, or just stay silent. Investigatives especially, we can't afford to lose you. This could be a tight game with the amount of neutrals there are, and even doing our best scum hunting, we might need some back up.

If you are a town power, think long and hard about revealing D2 after the 24 hour mark. It might be worthwhile, but it might be extremely dangerous. The only person I would definitely recommend not to reveal as Power is the Lawyer. Anything else, I think it's your call.
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Re: FM 7B | Tricks and Pranks Ensue | Day 1

Postby Invenio » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:56 pm

I added this for clarification under the prankster rolecard:

For clarification: These are the results the prankster overrides with it's action:
  • You were roleblocked!
  • You were transported!
  • You were controlled by a witch!
  • You were doused!
  • You were scared off by a marshal!
  • You were attacked but nursed back to health!
  • You were attacked but somebody fought off your attacker!
  • You were attacked but you are immune at night!
  • You were attacked but your vest saved you!
  • You slept peacefully!
Basically, if something happens TO you, you won't know. But if you do something to another person, you will know.
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