KatiyaKramer wrote:Remove from Ranked, but not from the entire game.
legacyofnick wrote:Change it so that the retributionist sacrifices himself to revive the dead person. This still supplies the role of bringing someone back from the dead (intended) but doesn't allow town to get additional voting power (town regaining a vote). This makes the choice of who you bring back more important as you must bring back someone who can change the game in town's favor.
wozearly wrote:...but if the Ret sacrifices himself for someone AFK, that's an unexpected (and unfair) shaft to the Town.
Also, it's not much fun for the Ret - "Your role is to keep hidden until you're able to sacrifice yourself to bring back someone who will be confirmed and actually has useful abilities. Just pray they're not dumb or AFK."
There have been a variety of alternative suggestions to make the life of the Retri and/or the revived person more difficult while keeping the general spirit of the role intact. For example:
1) Changing priority of the resurrect to be below killing, so a Ret attacked on the night they attempt to revive will not bring anyone back.
2) Making the Ret permanently unable to speak or whisper (similar to blackmailed) after resurrecting, so they cannot easily confirm themselves afterwards by whispering the revived target and have to run the risk of revealing themselves first (dovetails nicely with the first suggestion). Also has the amusing side-effect of making a silent defence on the stand a viable option in games with a confirmed but unidentified retri.
3) Making the resurrected Town member permanently unable to speak or whisper (similar to blackmailed), so they cannot share information from the dead or be used as a whisper co-ordinator
4a) Preventing the resurrected Town member from voting, so Town gains their ability but not their voting power
4b) Preventing the resurrected Town member from using their abilities, so Town only gains the voting power
Removing roles from the game, or from specific modes, really should be a last resort.
Kirize12 wrote:No role should be removed from specific gamemodes. Just replace it with Trapper so it'll work in all gamemodes, and make Trapper Jailor and Mayor part of town power.
Para's retributionist also works PROVIDED ONLY that it is in Town power, and not town protective.
Yemac wrote:Or remove the TS spot and change it to RT or to NB
KatiyaKramer wrote:Watt20I5 wrote:Yemac wrote:Or remove the TS spot and change it to RT or to NB
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Exactly. Why remove or ruin a good role like Ret that is perfectly fine in all other game modes, because it's causing issues in Ranked?
All Any: It's meant to be unbalanced and chaotic. Ret fits in fine.
Classic: Meant to be newbie mode that sides with town on the win rates. Ret fits in fine.
Custom modes: Ret can be put in or removed depending on the list creator.
Coven modes: Not an expert on them, but I never really hear complaints about ret in them either. But the entire mode isn't exactly balanced.
The majority of people who want Ret removed from play are people who play Ranked.
So either just pull the role from Ranked, or change up the role list.
I’ve already commented my opinion about your idea, so I’m just going to link it here.mdb1023 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWizDna1XO4
If the Amne picks a Town role (which happens often, either because it’s the majority and Amne thinks he’ll have an easier time, or he gets pressured into it), it’s the exact same as a townie Trauma Patient.Flake wrote:Uh, how?MysticMismagius wrote:I’ve already commented my opinion about your idea, so I’m just going to link it here.mdb1023 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWizDna1XO4
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=55611&start=850#p3156639
If the link is broken or you don’t feel like clicking, the TL;DR version is that making Ret into a trauma patient would make it too similar to Amne to be able to justify both of them being in the same game.
Basically the only similarity they have is that they both become a dead role. In almost every other aspect they are largely dissimilar; one is benign and swingy, one is town aligned and not nearly as swingy. One wants to choose a role in the interest of their own win chances, whereas the other wants to choose a role in the interest of Town's win chances. The way in which a Trauma Patient would go about playing is largely different to Amnesiac in general, similarly to how Escort and Consort would not go about playing in a similar way.
GarlicPops wrote:For the people that are arguing about the role being balanced on other modes, let me compare Retri to Bodyguard.
Many people don't like to play as bodyguard since when you do your job, you die. But you don't see people complaining the Bodyguard should be changed or anything.
The retributionist on the other hand is INSANELY overpowered in ranked and sometimes even in other modes. It confirms both himself and the person who was revived, any mediums and info from dead people, all of this with extra voting power, making it essentially a 11 v 5 instead of a 10 v 5. It was mathematically proven that evil's chance of winning in a game where a Retributionist revives is reduced to 8% or lower. So making the retributionist die when he revives will grant all of his benefits but without adding extra voting power, pretty much like how the Bodyguard works.
So the balance suggetions would be:
Retributionist
Abilities:
- Sacrifice your own life force to revive a dead Town member.
Attributes:
- If you get attacked, the ressurection will be interrupted
This will make so the Retri will actevely have to wait for an important town role to die, make it more difficult to confirm himself, easier for evils to claim it, and force tps to stay on him to revive a very important town role such as a mayor or jailor. This will keep all of the Retri's positive perks without breaking the game, pretty much how the bodyguard works.
And before people start complaining, balance IS important and ranked IS a priotity when it comes to balance. Again, you die as bodyguard and nobody is complaining, so stop thinking retri shouldn't be nerfed.
Watt20I5 wrote:Yemac wrote:Or remove the TS spot and change it to RT or to NB
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Yemac wrote:Watt20I5 wrote:Yemac wrote:Or remove the TS spot and change it to RT or to NB
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*in ranked. -.-'
Google wrote:Yemac wrote:Watt20I5 wrote:Yemac wrote:Or remove the TS spot and change it to RT or to NB
R A N K E D - I S - N O T - T H E - O N L Y - M O D E
*in ranked. -.-'
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