Achievement rework.

[Joacgroso]

I've just edited the OP. Thanks for your suggestions! Keep sending feedback!
Also, I noticed that the OP may not be very attractive. Do you have any tips to make it seem nicer/neater?

[JaguarJumps]

The mayor achievement is not gamethrowing, so it does not need a rework.

[Joacgroso]

Which one do you mean? Not revealing in the whole game shouldn't be rewarded, since it encourages being passive, and not revealing on stand is stupid af. Revealing day 1 is not bad though,

[BasicFourLife]

Which one do you mean? Not revealing in the whole game shouldn't be rewarded, since it encourages being passive, and not revealing on stand is stupid af. Revealing day 1 is not bad though,

The achievement limits your options.. every achievement which requires you to do sth while you have options to choose from is bad and limits plays.

[JaguarJumps]

Not revealing the whole game SHOULD be rewarded because sometimes it is completely unnecessary to reveal. It does not reward bad gameplay, it rewards ingenuity. There is more than one way to win the game.

[fwogcarf]

This achivement change is fine

[Joacgroso]

I don't think ingenuity should be rewarded either. As long as VFR is the meta, not revealing as mayor is a bad play. Not revealing because you thought it wasn't needed shouldn't be rewarded. If you don't like winning easily, fine, but that shouldn't be rewarded in a competitive team game. The achievement for not revealing on stand is totally bad. That may only be a good play if you were ressurrected by a retri and everyone knows your role (but why would you be on the stand then?). Revealing d2 is better than revealing d1 imo, since the jailor usually reveals himself d1, unlesss you think he may jail you. That one is arguable.

[JaguarJumps]

That's the thing VFR ISN'T the meta. So your entire point is irrelevant, especially since ingenuity is probably the only thing in this game that deserves to be rewarded. Not that anyone really cares about the achievements that strongly anyway.

[Joacgroso]

Did they nerf VFR in some way that I don't know? The last time I played it was totally the meta, and afaik the only relevant change made after that was the jester nerf. Also, I missed the meaning of that word. In spanish it's very similar to naivety. Of course ingenuity should be rewarded. But not revealing is not very ingenious anyway. It's just not using an ability. Confirming a townie is always good. Taking some time to reveal may be ok, but not doing it in the whole game doesn't help.

[JaguarJumps]

Doing it the whole game does help. The mayor has the potential to be the secret weapon at the end of the game and the mayor needs to recognize when it would be the most prudent for them to reveal. Hence they may never actually need to do so.

[dyaomaster]

Doing it the whole game does help. The mayor has the potential to be the secret weapon at the end of the game and the mayor needs to recognize when it would be the most prudent for them to reveal. Hence they may never actually need to do so.

But the achievement tries to make the Mayor not reveal during that final "secret weapon" stage. If the achievement had been designed to reward the type of plays you stated, it would be worded as "don't reveal before Day 5" or "reveal as the last Townie" or something similar. In addition, this also tells the Mayor not to reveal early when narrowing down the claimspace is most beneficial to Town.

[JaguarJumps]

But the achievement only gets rewarded when you don't NEED to reveal. Therefore, that secret weapon stage would never come to be. The achievement IS designed to reward the type of plays I stated, it usually is not a good idea for mayor to reveal early anyway.

[Rivelle]

Suggestion:

40 coins for lookout
Watch an escort roleblock a player

[Joacgroso]

Suggestion:

40 coins for lookout
Watch an escort roleblock a player

Thanks for reviving the thread after so much time. However, keep in mind that watching someone visiting a roleblocked person isn't especially good for town, since that person could still be consort or hypnotist. That achievement would only be a good idea in classic mode.

[Duckferno]

The Achievement for a fully powered Juggernaut and A Pestilence encountering each other is just bull. I've seem so many posts of people saying they cheated in order to do that. Such as using Discord. Also, the Executioner one for executing twice is pure game throw.

[Brilliand]

The Achievement for a fully powered Juggernaut and A Pestilence encountering each other is just bull. I've seem so many posts of people saying they cheated in order to do that. Such as using Discord. Also, the Executioner one for executing twice is pure game throw.

Or a Mafia majority.

[Joacgroso]

I don't think baiting the juggernaut into attacking you is a bad play. However, the achievement shouldn't be given to every single player in the game.

[PleaseReadSiege]

What's the point of changing jester achievements? Haunting evils roles doesn't encourage bad behavior. Jester is entitled to haunt whoever he wants, and evil roles should know they need to inno a jester just like anyone else.

Also:
"Win a game where you were the guardian angel's target."

This is impossible since jester can't be a GA target. Unless you're suggesting an amne-jester doing this.

[Joacgroso]

Jesters are NE, which means they are meant to hurt town and not evils. The achievements right now encourage them to help town by killing evil roles. That's why I think they should be encouraged to help evils with these achievements. Otherwise, they should be moved to the NB slot (which would be awkard since they would still be able to spawn from the NE slot as executioners), or completely overhauled (which, in my opinion, would make the role boring). Besides, evils usually try to help jesters since they know what they are, and can't inno them because it would make them look really suspicious. Jesters shouldn't be encouraged to punish that.

And yes, I should remove the achievements for situations were GA's target is a jester.

[PleaseReadSiege]

The fact that Jester is called neutral evil is a technicality and shouldn't dictate who he's supposed to help. He's not obligated to help any side. Nothing wrong with Jester helping the town (other than the fact that town wins too often, which is a balancing issue that refactoring achievements won't solve).

My suggestion would be to have a mixture of achievements for haunting town AND evil roles. Haunting an arso or SK is just as satisfying as haunting a mayor or jailor IMO.

Also, depending on how you look at it, haunting mafia, SK, Arso, etc can be viewed as the jester being evil, since the evils might have been expecting jester to help only to be betrayed. This is why haunting the survivor is one of the most evil things a jester can do, and is my favorite thing to do as jester

[Joacgroso]

The fact that Jester is called neutral evil is a technicality and shouldn't dictate who he's supposed to help. He's not obligated to help any side. Nothing wrong with Jester helping the town (other than the fact that town wins too often, which is a balancing issue that refactoring achievements won't solve).

It's more than a technicality because it determines whether jesters will spawn in ranked or not. The NE slot is meant to help evils without giving them an excesive advantage like a 5th mafia member or another NK. There's nothing wrong with jesters helping town as long as they are NB (besides the fact that they would probably be backstabbing someone who purposefully helped them win). But if they are NE, they have to help evils (or at least be more inclined to do so than to help town).

My suggestion would be to have a mixture of achievements for haunting town AND evil roles. Haunting an arso or SK is just as satisfying as haunting a mayor or jailor IMO.

Also, depending on how you look at it, haunting mafia, SK, Arso, etc can be viewed as the jester being evil, since the evils might have been expecting jester to help only to be betrayed. This is why haunting the survivor is one of the most evil things a jester can do, and is my favorite thing to do as jester

This achievements would be good if jesters were NB, but they are not. And haunting evils is not being evil. It's being an asshole. "evil", in ToS means "anti town". Survivors can also betray neutrals and make them lose, and that doesn't make them NE.

[MysticMismagius]

Imagine thinking that any neutral role besides Witch actually gives a damn about sides inherently
Even Witch only barely cares, and shouldn’t be held up as the norm for roles of its sub-alignment due to the fact that it doesn’t exist in half of the game

[Duckferno]

What's the point of changing jester achievements? Haunting evils roles doesn't encourage bad behavior. Jester is entitled to haunt whoever he wants, and evil roles should know they need to inno a jester just like anyone else.

Also:
"Win a game where you were the guardian angel's target."

This is impossible since jester can't be a GA target. Unless you're suggesting an amne-jester doing this.

This would be impossible in classic.

[PleaseReadSiege]

The fact that Jester is called neutral evil is a technicality and shouldn't dictate who he's supposed to help. He's not obligated to help any side. Nothing wrong with Jester helping the town (other than the fact that town wins too often, which is a balancing issue that refactoring achievements won't solve).

It's more than a technicality because it determines whether jesters will spawn in ranked or not. The NE slot is meant to help evils without giving them an excesive advantage like a 5th mafia member or another NK. There's nothing wrong with jesters helping town as long as they are NB (besides the fact that they would probably be backstabbing someone who purposefully helped them win). But if they are NE, they have to help evils (or at least be more inclined to do so than to help town).

My suggestion would be to have a mixture of achievements for haunting town AND evil roles. Haunting an arso or SK is just as satisfying as haunting a mayor or jailor IMO.

Also, depending on how you look at it, haunting mafia, SK, Arso, etc can be viewed as the jester being evil, since the evils might have been expecting jester to help only to be betrayed. This is why haunting the survivor is one of the most evil things a jester can do, and is my favorite thing to do as jester

This achievements would be good if jesters were NB, but they are not. And haunting evils is not being evil. It's being an asshole. "evil", in ToS means "anti town". Survivors can also betray neutrals and make them lose, and that doesn't make them NE.

Lol that's not being an asshole. NO ONE should help a known jester win. If the town knows you're jester, you're a bad jester, PERIOD.

[Joacgroso]

Imagine thinking that any neutral role besides Witch actually gives a damn about sides inherently
Even Witch only barely cares, and shouldn’t be held up as the norm for roles of its sub-alignment due to the fact that it doesn’t exist in half of the game

I suppose by "neutral" you mean NE, since most neutrals care about who wins (NK and NC care about their faction winning, while NB and pirates don't care at all). I wouldn't say witches "barely care" since making town lose is a big deal (although I get it if we're talking about all any). I think being inherently scum sided is the point of the NE alignement. Otherwise, there's no reason not to merge it with NB, is there?. Witches have to make town lose in order to win. Executioners have to hurt town, so they are inherently scum sided (although in a bad way, since they can help town later). Jesters should be NB in my opinion, but since they are not, I'm proposing that achievements that at least encourage them to hurt town.

Lol that's not being an asshole. NO ONE should help a known jester win. If the town knows you're jester, you're a bad jester, PERIOD.

If you got lynched, it's because evils voted you too, knowing that you can't be one of them. Tricking them into thinking you are evil, especially in ranked, is almost impossible. In fact, it's better to let them know you're a jester so they don't target you at night. If evils decided to help you to win, then killing one of them is a dick move. An "evil move" would be haunting a town member, because as I said, evil means "anti town".
And of course, you're a bad jester if the town knows it, but I never said otherwise. Mafia is a different case, since they know most evils from the start.