Town of Salem Game Forums

Gr8Banterr wrote:Blackmailer being able to read whispers would be way too overpowered.

If it was a Mayor game, they could see who is Jailor, Retributionist, Veteran and all those important roles. It would be devastating.

I believe that's the idea... it means that mayor games cannot go into full mayor game mode on day 2. Town actually has to check the posibility of a blackmailer, makes going mayor game an actual risk, rather than an instant raise odds of mafia winning by 95%.

It is no more OP than the possibility of a spy in a game, ensures mafia cannot communicate their roles, claims, and witches cannot tell the mafia who he/she is after she's found them.

With spy, all private chat works purely in towns favor currently, as scum can never be confident that their coms are secure. Town should have that risk as well.

Why would you remove vigilante and veteran deathnotes? I honestly don't see a reason for that, it would just be less fun to be those classes.

Batzcat wrote:Why would you remove vigilante and veteran deathnotes? I honestly don't see a reason for that, it would just be less fun to be those classes.

Nerfs confirmed Town by making them less confirmable
...
If that makes sense

JammySplodge wrote:

Batzcat wrote:Why would you remove vigilante and veteran deathnotes? I honestly don't see a reason for that, it would just be less fun to be those classes.

Nerfs confirmed Town by making them less confirmable
...
If that makes sense

Yes, but most of the time the death note isn't the thing that confirms TK, it's usually the will of the person who visits or is targeted by TK that gives it away

If you don't confirm yourself via Death Note whilst playing a non-Jailor TK, you're being an idiot 99% of the time. To leave this function in only cripples claimspace.

Err, that's a rather inflated percentage. >_> Revealing yourself through a Vigilante death note with a possible Witch in the game is a BadIdea™, fr'ex.

Veterans obviously should always reveal cuz it's ridiculously hard to do anything to a Veteran.

Interesting suggestions here, but a few things of note:

1) Arsonists are way stronger than Serial Killers with these changes. They'll lose to bad luck if they get investigated night one, but that's their only disadvantage versus SKs. (EDIT: Actually, is that even true? I don't know if Investigator priority is higher than Arsonist.) Any night past #1 they're damn near impossible to find with an Investigator, unlike an SK. Sheriffs can find them now, but they can already find SKs, so that doesn't make SKs any better than Arsos. The lack of douse notifications means Lookouts can no longer try to watch the non-doused townies to find the Arsonists. And SKs are usually screwed when they're jailed, whereas Arsos now don't even let town figure out that no one was doused the night they were jailed. That's a massive level of imbalance between the two NK roles. This is far and away the biggest complaint I have here. Really, finding an Arso under these rules is now basically up to luck or mayor-gaming. I don't mind a strong NK role, but having it in combination with a weak one is silly.

2) Amnesiacs under these rule changes are gonna have overwhelmingly high win rates. Since they can now join Mafia with more impunity than before, this is mostly a buff to the Mafia's win rate, which is fine in terms of faction balance, but for individual player win rates this is gonna skew things a bit. Basically an Amnesiac game would have to be a +1[win] -7[lose] ELO change or something similarly ridiculous, making Amnesiac games really #FeelsBadMan since you know you'll never gain any reasonable amount of ELO relative to the time spent playing.

3) Some of the Werewolf change suggestions are too complex to work with Jailors. So, what, jailing a WW gets you killed unless the WW killed two people the night before? Or it doesn't get you killed on an odd night unless the WW didn't kill two people the previous night? Really wonky rules there.

Not gonna discuss your removal of Neutral Unaligned (and Jesters) from the Ranked role-list, since I've seen posts from you that are so adamant about these changes that there's clearly no convincing you of how wrong you are on this front.
EDIT: Oh, I just realized my #2 complaint is incompatible with this statement, because you don't want Amnesiacs in Ranked. I guess I'll address this in a bit, then.

My thoughts: Sorry to say this, but I disagree with a lot of the things in this post.
One: The Town Power thing does not make any sense. How are Mayor and Retributionist different from Escort and Medium enough to make them have a new alignment? Because they have power? I don't understand how "Power" is something that these two roles posses that makes them different. I mean, yes, Mayor has "Power" of having three votes, and Retributionist has "Power" of bringing back someone dead, but Escort has "Power" of distracting others, and Medium has "Power" of speaking with the dead. So basically, you're splitting up Town Support in two for no reason at all, since the word used in the alignment does not separate the roles.
Two: This would have a negative impact on gameplay since adding a Town Power to the role list would guarantee either Mayor or Retributionist in the game. We might as well just have two Town Support and ditch the whole "Power" nonsense thing.

One: That is literally a flavor text complaint
Two: No it doesn't, Jailor is Town Power too

orangeandblack5 wrote:One: That is literally a flavor text complaint
Two: No it doesn't, Jailor is Town Power too

My thoughts: Actually, you're right. However, Retributionist should not be Town Power, it should just be Mayor and Jailor- that would have a possitive effect on gameplay.

Yesterday a confirmation was given by a moderator in the "Ask question" section that the mayor is getting nurfed, not buffed. Too bad that i actually liked playing as Mayor.

Why is Lookout Town Protective? I get that it can find out who killed someone, but it doesn't protect that person from death, like Doctor and Bodyguard. A lookout watching someone won't save their life, but find out who killed them, so I don't get why it would need to be a Town Protective role. Its purpose is to find out who people's roles are, making it Town Investigative.

If another Town Protective role is added, it will be swapped back.

That being said, Lookout is literally a protective role at its core. The end result is sinply different (notifications instead of actual protection).

orangeandblack5 wrote:If another Town Protective role is added, it will be swapped back.

That being said, Lookout is literally a protective role at its core. The end result is sinply different (notifications instead of actual protection).

In the Town of Salem Wiki, it says "Town Protectives are a group of people in the town that side with the Townies. Each night, they protect others from dying - or, once per game, potentially themselves."
Lookout does not meet these requirements.
However, it does meet the Town Investigative requirements: "Town Investigative are the alignment of those individuals in the town who side with the townies. They are able to gather information on the roles or actions of other players, which would eventually help them judge which players are their friends, enemies, and possible detractors."

That's a fan-made wiki. I fail to see any point. Especially since I could change those descriptions myself.

orangeandblack5 wrote:That's a fan-made wiki. I fail to see any point. Especially since I could change those descriptions myself.

*sigh*
I'm just going to ask you the obvious question once again...
What does Town Protective do? PROTECT! It's in the name... How do you fail to see this somehow? Town Protective PROTECTS people from dying. What happens if a Bodyguard protects someone? THEY DON'T DIE! What happens if a Doctor heals someone? THEY DON'T DIE! But what happens if a Lookout watches someone? They DO die if they are attacked regardless of whether a Lookout visits them or not. Do you someone NOT see that somehow? Like, ask anyone if Lookout should be Town Protective, and they will say no because it doesn't protect. If you do reply to this, once again disagreeing with me, I will simply not reply again, because no one in their right mind would agree that Lookout protects people from dying.

Are you asking a question or trying to start an argument?

According to orangeandblack5's 1.5 suggestions, Lookout's alignment should be Town Protective. Should it?

No.
It doesn't save anyone therefore it can't be a Protective.

Noooooo.

Lookout would be a terrible Town Protective role. His giant 1.5 thread was created way before the devs announced all the stuff coming to the official 1.5.0 patch, and I'm sure I can safely say not everything will be apart of that.

His thread was a big overhaul of the game, but check the dates of the threads.

orangeandblack5 wrote:Are you asking a question or trying to start an argument?

Just read this. http://www.blankmediagames.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=45646
It has answers coming from other people proving you wrong, because apparently, no matter what I say, you will disagree with me. Read it.

Oh wow

A thread with replies from two people that think you're confused about what's in the next update, both of whom have already given their thoughts in this thread (you know, the thread you're in right now, where you're supposed to talk about my suggestion instead of making an entirely seperate post to discuss a small part of my suggestion omnibus in an attempt to feed your ego).

I'm so impressed I think I just changed my mind

Just gonna ask for this to be merged with my thread.

Why make a separate thread to discuss my suggestion?

(@Nelly he knows it's a suggestion and not part of the actual update, he just really wants to be "proven right" on a nonissue)

orangeandblack5 wrote:Just gonna ask for this to be merged with my thread.

Why make a separate thread to discuss my suggestion?

(@Nelly he knows it's a suggestion and not part of the actual update, he just really wants to be "proven right" on a nonissue)

... Your thread is called 'Town of Salem 1.5'. It could be easily misinterpreted by someone who doesn't frequent the forums or know who anyone is.

RetralMega wrote:

orangeandblack5 wrote:Just gonna ask for this to be merged with my thread.

Why make a separate thread to discuss my suggestion?

(@Nelly he knows it's a suggestion and not part of the actual update, he just really wants to be "proven right" on a nonissue)

... Your thread is called 'Town of Salem 1.5'. It could be easily misinterpreted by someone who doesn't frequent the forums or know who anyone is.

But that isn't what happened here. Read anything he's posted recently in my ToS 1.5 thread.

Plus he said "should" twice.

orangeandblack5 wrote:Oh wow

A thread with replies from two people that think you're confused about what's in the next update, both of whom have already given their thoughts in this thread (you know, the thread you're in right now, where you're supposed to talk about my suggestion instead of making an entirely seperate post to discuss a small part of my suggestion omnibus in an attempt to feed your ego).

I'm so impressed I think I just changed my mind

I'm sorry, alright. I didn't mean to take this pointless argument so far. This wouldn't have been added into the game anyway, since this wasn't an official announcement thread, and was posted before the official preview. I just couldn't stand seeing something like that being added into the game. You're the one that's right here. I shouldn't have made a discussion page about this in a separate thread, either. I hope that after this we can all be cool.