Town of Salem 1.5 - Outdated?

[JazzMusicStops]

Exe and Jester should be in a separate alignment to NE or NB
which will only happen when (a) new NE role(s) is/are added
But they're fine as NE for now

Also, Orange, Jester has a statistically higher chance of hitting a town role than a scum role, just saying

[orangeandblack5]

Amnesiac has a statistically higher chance of choosing Town.

Your point?

Also, the whole "Neutral Avid" argument of an alignment for just Exe and Jester is really groundless. Amnesiac and Survivor break the game just as much, so just lump Jester in with them, and Exe too if you don't want to make it a Neutral Evil. Then remove that entire category from Ranked and bam.

[orangeandblack5]

Um...I have an idea...

Why don't we, rather than moving it to NB, modify Jester so that it's evil?

How about nah

Way too clunky.

[orangeandblack5]

Sorry for the double post, but this is noteworthy enough that editing my previous post just felt... wrong.

Framer now, along with removing any visits to its target from the Spy's night results, also shows the Framed target's visit (if it has one) to the Spy as if it were a Mafia visit.

[orangeandblack5]

Jester is a bastard role, so I removed it, Survivor, and Amnesiac from Ranked.

Then I made Exe so it couldn't side with everybody, only the evil roles. This should (hopefully) put it into your Tier 1, although it's not like this has been tested yet.

[JazzMusicStops]

My problem with the Doused targets smelling like gas thing is that it still doesn't give the Arso effective cover, I mean, sure, you can claim doused, but as soon as you ignite and don't die, you're going to be lynched

[BPsycho2]

Executioner ONLY hates his target. Town is fine.

Besides, in the next update, It's highly likely that both Survivor AND Executioner will be immune roles that side with anyone.

[Crazyzombie168]

I didn't agree with the Jester thing till reading some argument.

I can agree with a lot of this. But why should EXE need to have town lose to win? (I hope I didn't get what it was saying wrong... I probably did)

Also, why is there 4 Mafia in the new Rank playlist?

[orangeandblack5]

I didn't agree with the Jester thing till reading some argument.

I can agree with a lot of this. But why should EXE need to have town lose to win? (I hope I didn't get what it was saying wrong... I probably did)

Also, why is there 4 Mafia in the new Rank playlist?

It doesn't need Town to lose to win.

Town just has to kill it to win.

Once its target is hanged Exe wins no matter what. However, if it is Town that would win they now need to hang/kill the Exe first.

And there are 4 Mafia because 10 Town vs 3 Mafia vs 2 Neutrals would be really Town-sided and having 3 Neutrals just lowers game quality. Plus there are now 9 Town instead of 8, so...

[JazzMusicStops]

I didn't agree with the Jester thing till reading some argument.

I can agree with a lot of this. But why should EXE need to have town lose to win? (I hope I didn't get what it was saying wrong... I probably did)

Also, why is there 4 Mafia in the new Rank playlist?

It doesn't need Town to lose to win.

Town just has to kill it to win.

Once its target is hanged Exe wins no matter what. However, if it is Town that would win they now need to hang/kill the Exe first.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh
I now support your Exe changes much more now

[GFJmember]

First of all, apologies if this has been mentioned, but I'd rather not trawl through an 8 page topic, though I have noted someone has mentioned it earlier on this page

-Now makes doused targets "smell like gas" to an Investigator, effectively framing them as an Arsonist

That nerfs the investigator far too much.

Maybe reduce it so it only applies two nights, the night the person was doused and the following night.

[PolyesterHomes]

I didn't agree with the Jester thing till reading some argument.

I can agree with a lot of this. But why should EXE need to have town lose to win? (I hope I didn't get what it was saying wrong... I probably did)

Also, why is there 4 Mafia in the new Rank playlist?

It doesn't need Town to lose to win.

Town just has to kill it to win.

Once its target is hanged Exe wins no matter what. However, if it is Town that would win they now need to hang/kill the Exe first.

And there are 4 Mafia because 10 Town vs 3 Mafia vs 2 Neutrals would be really Town-sided and having 3 Neutrals just lowers game quality. Plus there are now 9 Town instead of 8, so...

Town would still just use Exe as a free town member and just lynch them after all the Mafia and NK's are dead. If you force them to kill the Exe first or lose, then it unfairly prevents them from winning when they have legitimate threats they can lynch that same day. Having him 'leave' town prevents such strategies and allows Town to not waste a day lynching the exe.

[orangeandblack5]

This may be possible; however, it is unlikely that this strategy would develop. It's WAY too risky to let a NE that cannot win with you live to be a viable strategy. And it no longer has immunity after hanging its target.

[orangeandblack5]

Except Exe can win with town.
As an exe you can claim it, strike a deal with town, live until the end and help lynch scum, and then get lynched yourself, right?
Unless I'm missing something.

But why would you? And, even if you did, why would the Town accept you? There is no benefit for the Town in this scenario, only risk.

[PolyesterHomes]

This may be possible; however, it is unlikely that this strategy would develop. It's WAY too risky to let a NE that cannot win with you live to be a viable strategy. And it no longer has immunity after hanging its target.

I see.
Still, there is little incentive for a NK or Mafia to kill the NE. The only role the loss of night immunity effects is the Vigilante.

[orangeandblack5]

Wrong. If it goes Town-sided (for some stupid reason), the Mafia/NK can take it out. And the mere possibility that they can (much) more easily take it out then Town is another driving force to stop it from attempting to help the Town.

Consider the following:
Take a Survivor. Thousands of people policy lynch Survivors because they are more likely to side with the scum. Now give the Survivor an extra goal that directly harms the Town. There is now even less reason for the Town to want the Survivor, even if it promises to play nice. Now, take away the Survivor's vests. There is now almost no reason the Town should want this thing around, and if it attempts to join the Town it now has no protection against at least two killing roles. Now, make it so the Town cannot win with the Survivor.

Do you see where this is going?

[PolyesterHomes]

I see what you mean.

[BPsycho2]

I see where you're going. Now, give it the ability to control people to visit other targets once per night. Now, change it's color name to purple. Now, name it Witch.





Why must the Executioner lose immunity after the win?

and also, why is it the town's enemy?

Just make more NE roles.

Also, for Jailor:

Leave him as normal, as he's unique for that reason. Town is supposed to be OP, without knowing who each other are.

But, he needs a limit, not a nerf. Make him die from killing Jesters. done.

Also, Vig, healed BG, and Vet need to not be insta-confirmed, so add Conjurer.

Arso still doesn't need those frames as he can't hide as a survivor, and is only limited to one tactic, so I'd still say Arso/BG/Bmer is the way to go.

[JazzMusicStops]

But, he needs a limit, not a nerf. Make him die from killing Jesters. done.

>Says he doesn't need a Nerf
>Suggests shitty Nerf

Also, Vig, healed BG, and Vet need to not be insta-confirmed, so add Conjurer.

aaaaaaaand, just what the fuck exactly is one of those?

[murat1996]

I like these.


They are simply and good.


Gw orange!

[BPsycho2]

But, he needs a limit, not a nerf. Make him die from killing Jesters. done.

>Says he doesn't need a Nerf
>Suggests shitty Nerf

Also, Vig, healed BG, and Vet need to not be insta-confirmed, so add Conjurer.

aaaaaaaand, just what the fuck exactly is one of those?

First one: that's not a bad Nerf. It's a limit so Jailor can't just execute anybody that is unconfirmed (and we're trying to eliminate confirmed townies.)

2: on the topic of confirmed townies, my conjurer role (in my signature) will do wonders with unconfirming.)

[BPsycho2]

Town is supposed to be OP

I'll remember this.

Not TOO op, but they have to be naturally more powerful than the Mafia. Meaning: Mafia don't get a Mayor, or a Jailor.

(Edit: can someone merge those for me? )

[JazzMusicStops]

First one: that's not a bad Nerf

Yes it is
It's fucking stupid

[KittyKnight]

But, he needs a limit, not a nerf. Make him die from killing Jesters. done.

First one: that's not a bad Nerf

Yes it is
It's fucking stupid

Jester is one of the easier(?) roles to win as (I think so anyway, I'm just a terrible at jester ;-;)

If its going to kill jailor when it gets executed, the jester might as well win when the jailor executes them.

Then people will start saying "Make it win when the vigilante shoots them"

And, a bit of a stretch, but "Make jester win when it dies"

And then its way too easy to win as jester.

Plus, it does seem very silly for jester to win should the jester get executed by the jailor...

Anyway, just throwing my viewpoint out here.

[BPsycho2]

That can be changed, if you'd like.