Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby SwampRabbit » Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:53 am

Yemac wrote:The first part where he claimed sheriff and said a doc was sus is gamethrowing. There are of course grey lines, like veteran and jailor pretending to be each other when all TP's are dead or something. (last night had a transporter game where trans moved himself with the vet and got GF killed - this is questionable, but not 100% throwing).
The second part however, is not throwing. It is always allowed to fake-claim to evils, maybe even to town (I often claim vet as vigilante or the other way around in whispers when I am sus of them).

There is a fine-line, but the way it is now is just stupid


I think it depends on why he was calling someone sus that he had not even checked. (Colby was jailed n1 so he was not knowingly calling a person sus that had showed as inno--Colby had not checked anyone.) If he was doing to harass someone, then he would have done it to me, and not to Juju. But I suspect he did it to Juju specifically because Juju told town he had been witched. (Colby correct me if I am wrong about why it was Juju you called out.) Only trash players call out that they were controlled by a witch when they are evil roles. So there was a near certainty that Juju was not evil. But look at the info gained by that one vote--the people who voted Juju up to the stand and those who voted him guilty were almost all evil roles. So even though, tragically, the lovely Juju was lynched, nearly all evil roles revealed themselves with that one vote.

And to your second part, you 100% agree that fake claiming a role as town should not result in an automatic game throwing ban. There are many ways and reasons to fake claim as town. Some are very simple--like vet vs vig claims, med vs retri claims--and others are more nuanced and strategic.
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby Yemac » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:19 pm

I mean... I think it was kinda implied that fake-claiming based on strategy is different then fake-claiming TI or something.

But pretending to be NK because 'I didn't want mafia to attack me' and shit like that should be reportable. I think there can be no hard rules with this, but often it's pretty easy to see if something was strategy, or blatant throwing
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby SparkingJay » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:19 pm

diditemp wrote:acshully im the vet lmao

Seeing as you cannot spell, go sit at the Kids table until the adult talk is over. We do not want you to pick up on any bad words which will scar your innocent little brain for life. It is also quite ironic how you are fake claiming being over the age of 10 yet made a subject about "Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing."


STAY IN SCHOOL KIDS.

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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby MysticMismagius » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:25 pm

Wasn't the reason diditemp wrote "acshully im the vet lmao" to mock the people who do this? It was an intentional misspelling to accentuate a point, not them being "unable to spell."
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby SwampRabbit » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:27 pm

Yemac wrote:I mean... I think it was kinda implied that fake-claiming based on strategy is different then fake-claiming TI or something.

But pretending to be NK because 'I didn't want mafia to attack me' and shit like that should be reportable. I think there can be no hard rules with this, but often it's pretty easy to see if something was strategy, or blatant throwing


No, no, no, no, no.

Fake claiming any town role as another townie is ok when doing it for strategic reasons. The only one I disagree with personally is a d1 vet claim who claims jailor and alerts on n1, but even I would not label that automatically as game throwing because of the slippery slope it would lead to with other fake claims made by townies.

Keep in mind that all of this is dependent on the player in question not leaving wills or making comments that it was for some reason other than legitimate strategy to win. Any time someone makes questionable strategic moves AND admits it was for game throwing reasons--those players should be reported and found guilty based on their confessions.
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby SparkingJay » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:28 pm

MysticMismagius wrote:Wasn't the reason diditemp wrote "acshully im the vet lmao" to mock the people who do this? It was an intentional misspelling to accentuate a point, not them being "unable to spell."

I seeeee. I thought he was saying he was the Veteran from the game. My bad Didi :)

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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby diditemp » Wed Sep 04, 2019 1:11 pm

Woosh. Maybe if you weren't so keen to make personal attacks you'd have noticed what I was doing there.

And yes, I absolutely think lynching a doc by fake claiming sheriff for no reason is gamethrowing. Just because he managed to reel it back in doesn't mean it was a good strategy, that's crazy.
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby Brilliand » Wed Sep 04, 2019 2:24 pm

SwampRabbit wrote:The only one I disagree with personally is a d1 vet claim who claims jailor and alerts on n1


In the current ranked meta, this is effectively gamethrowing, but in a different meta, it might not be. I could easily see this being a good strategy in Classic Classic, or in certain Custom rolelists.
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby MrChuckleteeth » Wed Sep 04, 2019 5:56 pm

diditemp wrote:@MrChuckleTeeth I'm aware it isn't currently gamethrowing, that is why this is in Suggestions.

I used this as a specific example, but I actually hate how narrow the definition of gamethrowing is in general.

Also as far as examples go, I was in another game where the vet killed someone and then got hung and lost town the game because the last maf claimed his vet kill while he claimed med or something until he was about to be hung. "acshully im the vet lmao" ok. Stupidity isn't reportable, but that doesn't mean we should see the same stupid accidental throw over and over.


Fake claiming itself is not gamethrowing and will never be gamethrowing.

It's all context dependant.
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby MrChuckleteeth » Wed Sep 04, 2019 5:57 pm

MysticMismagius wrote:Ultimately this is less about gamethrowing and more about people having absolutely no idea how strategy works in this game. The game doesn't even teach players all its mechanics, let alone how to make the most out of the abilities you have. People honestly think dumb shit like this is a good idea because they saw it work one time, but didn't fully understand why or how it worked.

The solution isn't to ban such things as gamethrowing, but for there to be more of a guiding presence to teach new players how to play the game rather than the current "sink or swim" mentality the game has towards newbies.


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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby JacksonVirgo » Wed Sep 04, 2019 6:08 pm

Fake claiming as towns can win the game. So would you report those who fake claim and win the game for you?
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Re: Fake claiming as town should be gamethrowing.

Postby diditemp » Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:43 am

No, because as I said it shouldn't be a rule in it's own right but should qualify under gamethrowing rules when it leads to that or is an obvious attempt. The same way as, say, not revealing as mayor isn't against the rules by any means, but if you refused to reveal when it was pivotal to winning the game then imo it's gamethrowing. At the very least it would make people less reckless about using it.
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