Town Traitor Beta Opening Friday!

[emslaya]

Lobby isnt very active right now. We need at least a few more active players to actually have at least one game running at a time atm.

Thoughts so far:
Retri= pretty OP in this mode. Confirms two townies.
Lag is monstrous at times, especially whenever i try to open up the chatlog.

I've encountered the glitch where maf isn't able to kill revealed mayors or rezzed townies. Is it possible that maf is simply unable to kill any player with a known role atm? (ie the player's role appears next to their name in the player list.)

[MysticMismagius]

@Achilles you mention in the OP that Town Traitor will be a weekly rotating mode:

What is Town Traitor?
Town Traitor will be a new weekly rotating game mode in which a random member of the Town is selected to secretly join sides with the Mafia/Coven faction.

Currently there are no rotating modes in Classic. Will Town Traitor be the start of rotating modes in Classic, and if so, what will it be rotating with?

[Achilles]

@Achilles you mention in the OP that Town Traitor will be a weekly rotating mode:

What is Town Traitor?
Town Traitor will be a new weekly rotating game mode in which a random member of the Town is selected to secretly join sides with the Mafia/Coven faction.

Currently there are no rotating modes in Classic. Will Town Traitor be the start of rotating modes in Classic, and if so, what will it be rotating with?

Yeah hasn't been added yet. Will rotate with Vampire game mode and maybe some other things (I have an idea for another unique game mode in a few more months)

[MysticMismagius]

@Achilles you mention in the OP that Town Traitor will be a weekly rotating mode:

What is Town Traitor?
Town Traitor will be a new weekly rotating game mode in which a random member of the Town is selected to secretly join sides with the Mafia/Coven faction.

Currently there are no rotating modes in Classic. Will Town Traitor be the start of rotating modes in Classic, and if so, what will it be rotating with?

Yeah hasn't been added yet. I knew that... Will rotate with Vampire game mode and maybe some other things (I have an idea for another unique game mode in a few more months)

Oh, interesting. Thanks!

[techyleo]

@Achilles I often wait in lobby for hours for Classic TT, and there has been a maximum of 2 games running at the same time, and most people in lobbies think that it is because of tickets

[MysticMismagius]

So it appears that the role list discussion board is dead, so I'm going to repost my post-play appraisal of the role list from there here:

Let's bring some discussion about the list back up now that we've gotten a chance to actually play this mode, shall we?

Achilles had suggested this list earlier in the thread and included it in today's yesterday's test run.

Spoiler: Sheriff
Jailor
Doctor
Lookout
Mayor
Town Investigative
Town Protective
Town Killing
Town Support
Random Town
Godfather
Mafia Deception
Mafia Support
Executioner
Witch

I did not like this list all too much when I saw it, and now that I've played it my issues with it are basically the same as they were then: not enough claim space for Mafia, WAY too many guaranteed role slots for Town, and guaranteed Exe not really "shaking things up" as much as one would expect because guaranteed Exe slot neuters the one thing that makes Exe shake things up.

In the Beta thread, Achilles proposed this:

I wonder if just replacing executioner with another RT would work out better. Mafia seem to be winning a lot.

I'm not 100% sold on this idea, but I do think it would be interesting to consider. However, such a change requires rethinking how the entire role list would work, especially with regards to the resident Witch. Witch only makes sense as a neutral role in a list with diverse evils to work with; something already lacking in the current role list but would be made even worse if Exe was replaced with a Town slot. If Witch is the only neutral role, and there are only Townies and Mafia, then Witch might as well be just another Mafia member who has to find her team and can’t win when alone or with just the Traitor. And then there's no point to having the Witch. It'd be simpler and better to just cut neutrals out of the picture entirely at that point, and have a 10v5. If we were to go this route, I propose a role list that looks like this:

Spoiler: Mayor/Jailor #HotTake, Mayor is more interesting as Town Traitor's resident mainstay TL than Jailor is. However, as a Traitor Jailor is less OP imo, so I could accept either role being here.
Town Investigative Remapped Sheriff as TI
Town Investigative Same as before
Town Protective Remapped Doc as TP
Town Protective Same as before
Town Killing Same as before
Town Support Same as before
Random Town Remapped Jailor/Mayor as RT, because guaranteed Jailor and guaranteed Mayor gives town a lot of power unless one of them happens to be Traitor
Random Town Remapped LO as RT, because 3 TI slots is a bit too much
Random Town Remapped Exe
Random Town Original RT slot
Godfather Same as before
Mafioso This is the best 4th Maf in a pre-TMK environment. If and when TMK is implemented, I'd want this to be replaced with an RM slot.
Mafia Deception (Replace with RM after rebalance patch)
Mafia Support (Replace with RM after rebalance patch)
Is the MD + MS slot thing just a band-aid fix for the MS roles being generally better than the MD roles? Or is it just so you don't see the same RM role twice? If we don't replace the Exe slot with RT, I still think it needs to be replaced with something. Guaranteed Exe isn't really doing this mode many favors, and the role list in general needs improvement. Here's my proposal for a role list which includes neutrals:

Spoiler: Mayor/Jailor
Town Investigative Remapped Sheriff
Town Investigative Same as before
Town Protective Remapped Doc
Town Protective Same as before
Town Killing Same as before
Town Support Same as before
Random Town Remapped Jailor/Mayor
Random Town Remapped LO
Random Town Original RT slot
Godfather
Mafia Deception
Mafia Support
Neutral Benign I prefer NB + NE over 2NE because that provides more variety in what roles are in play without introducing NKs and Vampires. But 2NE wouldn't be the end of the world.
Neutral Evil This gives Exe some of that surprise factor it desperately needs.

Basically I wanted to keep a similar structure to Achilles’s original role list for this one, while editing mostly to fix the things that I view as wrong with the original. Thoughts?

[Poirot633]

Don't know if this has been reported yet, but traitor mayor won even though Town won.

I also agree that Exe should be replaced by NB.

[orangeandblack5]

Exe for NB is not genuinely helpful

Amne is confirmed non-Traitor making it much stronger in this mode than normally

Survivor is just pointless Exe

I'd sub it for Mafioso if we're going to tweak the strength of the best traitors, or a RT otherwise

Still Mystic's first list is basically spot-on

[MysticMismagius]

Exe for NB is not genuinely helpful

Amne is confirmed non-Traitor making it much stronger in this mode than normally

Survivor is just pointless Exe

I'd sub it for Mafioso if we're going to tweak the strength of the best traitors, or a RT otherwise But then that's basically the first list, I wanted to have a second option that included neutrals but didn't have the issues with guaranteed Exe. So would 2NE be better?

Still Mystic's first list is basically spot-on

[orangeandblack5]

Neutral Evils honestly take away from the idea of finding the Town Traitor

Witch works but I'd take GF/Maf/RM/RM over it

I'd also appreciate longer phases but I should really do a write-up on my thoughts thus far at some point when I have time to go more in-depth on that kinda stuff

[MysticMismagius]

Neutral Evils honestly take away from the idea of finding the Town Traitor Fair enough

Witch works but I'd take GF/Maf/RM/RM over it Pretty much. Witch is best in a more diverse role list like I said earlier, and that doesn't mesh with Town Traitor.

I'd also appreciate longer phases but I should really do a write-up on my thoughts thus far at some point when I have time to go more in-depth on that kinda stuff

I also noticed that you sent a list which was slightly tweaked in the other board. I specifically want there to be two TP slots, because otherwise if Traitor is TP then attacking the Mayor/Jailor could potentially be safe on N1. I wanted to avoid this.

[orangeandblack5]

No I think that's good

That wasn't a list I sent because I think it's the best now, it's what I had suggested originally and is only off from your new suggestion by the second TP slot

[MysticMismagius]

It seems that I too need to learn how to read, then.

I wanna see what people think about the idea of cutting Neutrals out of Town Traitor entirely before we commit to it, since it is quite a drastic change.

[orangeandblack5]

#FullSend

[atrufflewormono]

oh no i ran out of tickets

[emslaya]

oh no i ran out of tickets

Also ran out of tickets. Will we be able to get more tickets in the future?

[Achilles]

oh no i ran out of tickets

Also ran out of tickets. Will we be able to get more tickets in the future?

You both burned through 20 tickets already? Impressive. I can reup you.

[atrufflewormono]

oh no i ran out of tickets

Also ran out of tickets. Will we be able to get more tickets in the future?

You both burned through 20 tickets already? Impressive. I can reup you.

That'd be much appreciated

[emslaya]

oh no i ran out of tickets

Also ran out of tickets. Will we be able to get more tickets in the future?

You both burned through 20 tickets already? Impressive. I can reup you.

Thanks!!!

[orangeandblack5]

It's a solid mode

[MysticMismagius]

yeah but it seems like it's been slow going today. Tried to start a game a few minutes ago and there were literally 17 people in the entire PTR, so I had to wait for people to slowly join in

[Achilles]

yeah but it seems like it's been slow going today. Tried to start a game a few minutes ago and there were literally 17 people in the entire PTR, so I had to wait for people to slowly join in

There are 500 people who created accounts. Wonder why so few are on.

[MysticMismagius]

yeah but it seems like it's been slow going today. Tried to start a game a few minutes ago and there were literally 17 people in the entire PTR, so I had to wait for people to slowly join in

There are 500 people who created accounts. Wonder why so few are on.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Perhaps most of the people who made accounts are doing something important rn, like having dinner or sleeping? No one knows.

[Luxley850]

Realized that I had to make a PTR Account, if anyone in this forum gets an award for being the biggest idiot, I'm right here!

[atrufflewormono]

Realized that I had to make a PTR Account, if anyone in this forum gets an award for being the biggest idiot, I'm right here!

f