Town of Salem Game Forums

EdwardENygma wrote:you should've just not claimed to FML, AND/OR not claim cop

and yes paranoid that includes you

Yeah the cop bit was where dun goofed, we talked about that in dead chat

As for acting scummy and all, town suffered for it so meh things worked out. Town should really know better for priorities when things are going bad as they were. Lose too many already then a neutral is not priority. That's like lynching witch when mafia is getting to majority. Doesn't turn out well in the end. Also turns out I was right anyways but you know that's just semantics at this point.

Pretty much fucking with town to keep numbers the same. I would have gone for Short next to see what I could learn with them and go from there working both sides. Unfortunate for town to kill off a regenerating shield and all as well as information gatherer.

Scum was pretty obvious but meh I had fun causing chaos. Town was a bit silly this game and got steamrolled

I like that people are caught up on the win con thing, I'm not supposed to win as I am. I'm supposed to be on one of the sides as they start losing. Although with all the hydras there are less players with votes so not entirely impossible either.

With that said, I'll go ahead and place some reads in a bit but preliminary is cow is likely also neutral. Pretty positive about this, their play is not town aligned and too ridiculous to be scum. I'm assuming with a claim like theirs they are either a phantom or shade, or somehow benefit from being attacked. Similar to my Sweeny Todd role in UPick.

The push and logic on Cakez is pretty shit, more than likely scum pushed wagon. Look back and check from there.

Retral and FML, are part of a trio figuring out that will do better got town. Or scum really. Who knows

Only they're not, you don't have to believe it but it's true. You can try attacking me if you want.

If they were just a town crier they wouldn't be able to actually have a vote, it kind of proves my point for anyone that actually thinks

Since my results are legitimate, Mel is scum and I can not only protect particular targets like Cow at night while also finding out names and such to actually solve the game pretty easily.

Town to lose, they've already lost three members and more are to come. Pretty much handing it to the minority on a silver platter

It is the truth, my Wincondition is to put simply, "you cannot win as you are unless you are the only remaining player with a vote."

You're right when you say I'm not town because I'm not. However I'm not scum either. I'm about as neutral as it gets. My job is to maintain a balance between the majority and the minority. I need to make sure one side does not get the upper hand.

However you are wrong abut my information, it is all legitimate. All the checks are true but only because I need to be able to find out who is aligned where to help try and sway the game to maintain balance. Which is what I do through Ignis. If one side starts to lose too much I get put on their team and have to help them come back. Town has lost three members already and many of them do not count to voting as my role states that I can win as my role only if I am the only player alive with a vote and I doubt minority would have too many without votes. It's an assumption sure but I like to hang on the side of caution with these things at the best of times.

So TL;DR
I'm neutral with an objective to maintain balance on both sides. Should I fail this I get put on the current losers side to help them come back. My information is correct to help me maintain this balance and sway the game as needed. Ignis just announces my results for me and acts as a shield at night to whomever I wish. Like STAA they will regenerate if successful but they cannot be killed directly.

My theory is that scum has a hydra as well similar to myself and Erravi/STAA. One of the remaining hydras about is likely it and used to protect the minority faction. Lets face is, neither the majority nor the minority would get a role that uses the mod.

TheCow wrote:

ElusiveBelle wrote:Hey Cow, that role you know that has extra votes. Do you think it is town or scum aligned? Same goes for the one that gave Mel an extra vote.

Is this redirection or "clever" rhetoric?

it's a legitimate question if you want to save the town.

Hey Cow, that role you know that has extra votes. Do you think it is town or scum aligned? Same goes for the one that gave Mel an extra vote.

TheCow wrote:

ElusiveBelle wrote:Because there is no case, go sit in the corner and jest to yourself Cow. We'll maybe be nice and lynch you later if you need it.

Okay, Swords.

Belle claimed an impossible role. Belle is lying about his role, to an unknown extent.

You don't have to believe a role exists but it's been confirmed by others already, I can even jail you tonight if you want to be sure. I don't really mind.

Regardless the fact is that there are neutrals in play otherwise Ignis would have no reason to be a protective vote for me. It's a useless ability if there was no reason for it. Jester, Shade, or Phantom is very likely in play.

Because there is no case, go sit in the corner and jest to yourself Cow. We'll maybe be nice and lynch you later if you need it.

TheCow wrote:

IAmAMunchlax wrote:@Cow you're telling us Elusive's claim is bullshit yet they mostly confirmed most of the abilities they said they had. Do you have actual proof that thye're scum, or is it just because you're fully doubting their claim?

They are claiming two players worth of abilities. The crier is anonymous. Belle does not have both kits.

You're right I don't, Ignis has the other like I've said. Similar to how the other hydras work. Who would have thunk it.
If you feel like bringing up an argument that isn't just badly made assumptions or jester like play by all means do so. This is just silly nonsense and should be treated as such.

EdwardENygma wrote:

ElusiveBelle wrote:I'm going to trust Short's claim for now, and I do want to ask if there is anything else Met can do or is it just a broadcast system of sorts for said results. It makes more sense now why they cant be voted and all that if they're more or less just a "Town Crier" for another role. Seems rather powerful but a moot point when outed. Do they go if/when you do similar to Erravi and STAA? Would put more credibility to their claim.

This post equates lots of questions that are relevant to determine Short's alignment; the most important part being the one where they serve no purpose and supposedly Short would be taken in for questioning anyway.

ElusiveBelle wrote:I explained this to FML, when Short claimed my role I was asking them a lot of questions, questions that now I have revealed have to do with my real role. I wanted to know everything they would claim before jailing them that night to talk to them and pressure them for a claim and get their real role. However when it looked like the vote was shifting to Short after they retracted the claim I switched back to FML.

Vote shifting to short implies you expected them to be lynched, hence change of targets. However still voted Erravi anyways. This narrative implies you both believed Shortcut was scum and soon-to-be lynched and yet preferred to pursue the person whose your only reasoning for voting against was claiming a hydra type. Fittingly, this vote was done through Ignis, the anonymous. "Jester protection" my ass.

I'm just catching up but what even logic is this

The first part I wanted to know all that Short would claim, clearly after seeing my claim my line of questioning was based of what I knew and how it worked. Get enough information you can turn it on them later. Simple plan and effective

Part Deux, the vote for Erravi was put in before I went to bed the night prior to the morning of the lynch. Met didn't get on until later when the vote was placed. As I was busy doing other things like switching jail targets and asking questions I forgot the vote was placed already and only had it remembered after it was placed and then the quick hammer came in relatively soon after.

As a side note since people forget:
I do not roleblock, my target gets released half way into the night to do their actions and such. All I get is to talk to them for 24 hours and then their role name.

Other note: Cow is usually a lot better in games I've seen them in, considering what Ignis does for me I wouldn't be surprised with a Jester like flip to be honest here. I'm expecting there to be one at least since Ignis is my voting puppet as a shield of sorts.

Cow's claim is full of convenience and assumptions which is rather silly, but they didn't even use their ability last night otherwise Gent wouldn't have been roleblocked as they claimed and Mel wouldn't get two votes. That much is obvious. There is too much evidence to the contrary despite what madness cow believes in for me to "visit" them. I will say that "Beloved princess" type claim is pretty sketchy anyways.

Cow is likely "reaction testing" or something but didn't quite plan it out right.

Okay so Cow's argument is that I'm apparently scum buddies with the "real" Relius Clover? Or some inane reachy nonsense like that? Honestly this is even more reachy than FML was with the Moon thing. That's basically all it amounts to and there wasn't even an argument to back it up aside from more nonsense of "I'm confirmed because I said so so listen to me."

Cow's argument is just a bunch of wat rolled around in confusion. Still need to ask Met if not knowing about a hydra thing would be considered bastard or not. Has anyone confirmed this yet or not? The reachingness of this nonsense is just that nonsense.

Not to mention the astounding jumps of logic here from just getting names for their night results. I at least had connectable dots from the conclusions I made when told about FML's role name and having Retral/Halk claim in thread about being Luna.

There really isn't much to do here when someone is spouting nonsense with a basis that is essentially an assumption that has already been disproven by other actions. Moving along now.

I'm here, give me a moment to make heads or tails of Cow's psycho babble. I'm still trying to figure out what they're trying to say then can work into actually discussing it. Also busy with other things so it may take until morning to get a coherent post together we'll see. Regardless sending in for an unvote for the time being. I know the results are good but others seem to disagree because questionable logic.

Cow's claim is a bunch of what, however question. Are we allowed to confirm if we see an "official" name in a QT. Such as with the star and what not? Otherwise FML can confirm that as I was the jailer so Cow's point is moot. However if they want to prove it I can jail them instead to see it. Cow is likely scum with Mela though.

Next question, would unknown hydra be considered bastard? I don't like that idea of the claim and it seems more like scum trying to protect scum and get a strong town role lynched.

@Mela
I did answer your question, just becuase you don't like the answer doesn't mean it isn't there. If that is all you really have though it's pretty weak defense. A cute one but weak

You want to make a point but it's all just angry babble and I wanted to give it the benefit of the doubt yesterday, which I even told FML last night. However it amounts to nothing with a weak defense of nothing. Just doubtcasting without proving yourself town. Instead of trying to fling mud and rage at everything try and prove yourself town. I know the results are legit and you clearly don't like that because you're scum but if you cant argue why you're even town then there isn't much of a decision to make here on you being scum.

P-Edit:
@ Tarot
I explained this to FML, when Short claimed my role I was asking them a lot of questions, questions that now I have revealed have to do with my real role. I wanted to know everything they would claim before jailing them that night to talk to them and pressure them for a claim and get their real role. However when it looked like the vote was shifting to Short after they retracted the claim I switched back to FML.

All of FML's point are pretty bad or just illogical, what their angle here is I don't know but I did have a town read on them but this is just silly or some hardcore doubtcasting.

1. I did lie and I had my reasons, you don't have to like them but they're there and logical. Not to mention that I claimed PC to you out of the gates so the point is moot.
2. Ignis's immunity is a given when they cant be voted but you know logic. Not to mention that's it's irrelevent other than the point of protecting me from votes as is their job. Similar to how STAA protected Erravi from attacks.
3. Prematurely in which point, at night or in thread when you told me to? Regardless both had reason behind it that I explained in quite a bit of detail. As for the immunity yes, I do tend to share information as I get it. I do have to ask Met questions too you know.
4. I also explained this but you know it helps your point to not share that right? That the part I believed their claim but not their alignment. That is a a big detail to leave out, but you know cherry picking helps your point doesn't it. I believed their hydra claim because I am part of one. I doubted the alignment because I am town and found it doubtful to have another as town.
5.This is about as reachy as it gets but considering the logic used before hand I suppose you needed to try something "legitimate" for an actual case.

I still doubt FML is scum, but this is definitely not townie behavior to be cherry picking and reaching to prove your own points. If you want to pull a stunt like this know that I would naturally give the full details and not just what you want to share with the class.

Now pardon while I google Cow's claim for a moment to see the wiki.

melanora wrote:Elusive, answer the fucking question.

If/When I flip Town, what will you have to say for yourself? What will be your defense? I want to know.

Furthermore - How many people have claimed Hydras? At this point, Hydras should fucking claim already. At least one of them has to be scum. No way are all hydras all Town.

Finally - let me write up a full scum list so that AFTER I AM DEAD I can still fucking help Town.

JFC.

I am the lynch target for today, and I'm going to vote for myself with my double vote, but why is everyone in such a damn rush to lynch me? That's the scummy thing. Day has only been going for a day and a half. HOLD YOUR HORSES

To be fair a lot gets missed in the storm that this became, so pardon for missing a question there.

As for the question itself, bottom line is you wont. According to the reads there is no way for you to be town. Neutral I will believe and if the truth comes out about what type of neutral and what you can do I'd be willing to listen. Otherwise then you'd be scum and that's that and the lynch will go through as expected

Now lets play hypotheticals since that is the point, if some how you magically flip majority then I will likely talk to Met while I can about what would cause or can cause the results to come out like they can to then determine what is happening. The "defense" will come from what I can get from Met about that as I would presume more "modifiers" or something else in play would be the cause and then would have something to work with to determining how that comes about. Search ISOs for anyone that would seem to know more than they should after the first results came out and things like that.

P-Edit:
To be fair I put the vote in earlier, just came late.

I'm going to have Ignis vote Mel, they're not majority according to the scans but the possibility of neutral is still a thing so better safe than sorry.

To answer FML's question from way back when, when I placed the vote via Ignis that was after I realized I could do it. I spent a lot of time talking to Met on what Ignis was supposed to do for me and how it all worked since it was worded funny.

Hiphoplog wrote:You probably can't do it to part of a hydra which is not the main body. Like you probably couldn't target STAA but could target Cyan.

I'd let you experiment on me. Sounds fun.

I kinda figured the same just not on Hydras in general, why not can have fun just chatting at night.
As for the experimenting, I don't get to choose but we'll see if it works

It could be, I don't really know but was thinking the same thing. We can still technically find out if I take Mel tonight and just lynch tomorrow before the can use it and such just to know how it works. It's a risky play but plausible. Unless someone else wants to come forward with something similar they need "activating". The only thing is I would want the town version of Mel or whatever to wait until we're sure that is how it works before coming forward and such otherwise it is a wasted reveal for nothing.